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 ARCHIVED TOPIC: As Originally Recorded Tab Books. Not Simplified.


Please note this is an archived topic, so it is locked and unable to be replied to. You may, however, start a new topic and refer to this topic with a link: http://www.banjohangout.org/archive/380743

arlum - Posted - 01/23/2022:  06:59:15


Are their any Bluegrass Banjo Tab books that are the true "as originally recorded" type? While simplified versions to get your feet wet might appeal to some new players they don't appeal to me. I really dislike mastering a Tab and then finding out it's not the same as whoever made it famous played it. It's harder for me to unlearn than it is to learn. Adding new stuff to something I've already worked hard at getting down just perfect is a real pain. Even if it takes five times as long I'd rather know for sure that the Tab I'm learning from the first time will result in my playing it exactly the way any great banjo players in the audience know it should be played. None of that, "He's doing so & so's easy version" or "When he learns it the right way he could be a darn fine player to listen to". So ....... Are their any Bluegrass Banjo Tab books out there that will deliver accuracy right out of the gate?

cobra1 - Posted - 01/23/2022:  07:13:53


Richard, take a look at Jake Harfields books. They are pretty good with advanced solos. They can be for beginner to advance. I have his Old Time Gospel book. I don't know if this is what you are looking for but it's a start. They are available on his web site or Amazon. I'd use his site.

BeeEnvironment - Posted - 01/23/2022:  07:16:22


You can see Pete Seeger's "Goofing Off Suite" tab book (I uploaded it here on BHO) He has some 3 finger in there, and you can listen to his youtube recordings which pretty much follow the tab.

RB3 - Posted - 01/23/2022:  07:34:51


Those that immediately come to mind are the Earl Scruggs And The 5-String Banjo instruction book and the AcuTab series of tablature books. I would also point you to tabs in the BHO archive by Jack Baker that are transcribed from recordings. Jack gets them right, and his tabs often include references to the recordings from which the transcriptions were derived.

Alex Z - Posted - 01/23/2022:  07:58:17


In addition to the Earl Scruggs and AcuTab books, there are books by several players of their own playing -- such as Tony Trischka, Peter Wernick, Bill Keith, Bob Black, several by Alan Munde.  Also Homespun Tapes usually includes tablatures for the pieces played in the videos, such as for Jens Kruger.



There is a lifetime of material from the master players, ready for us to explore. smiley

Texasbanjo - Posted - 01/23/2022:  08:38:27


Jack Hatfield has transcriptions of many Scruggs songs that are note for note. You can purchase them on his site: hatfieldmusic.com. Be sure to ask for the advanced tab, as he also has tabs that are simpler, easier to use. Jack's beginner books are not note for note, but are simple arrangements that are much easier to learn and play. Jack's a member here.

The original Earl Scruggs book has tab but not all of it is correct, there are several places that have mistakes. I believe most of those transcription errors were corrected in the newer version.

Jack Baker also has many transcriptions of Scruggs and others that are pretty much note for note. Check out the tab archives and see how many he's posted that you can download for free. If you don't find what you want, contact him, he's a member here and maybe has, or can tab out (for a price) the song(s) you want.

thisoldman - Posted - 01/23/2022:  09:35:28


I saw that Sherry recommended Jack Baker's tabs in the tab archive. That was my first thought as well. And it has been mentioned a number of times on the HO that our banjo greats probably never played the same tune the same exact way every time. A transription of a recording is a artifact of the way that tune was played that day. Or somebody's interpretation of how it was played.

I think you will find as you grow as a player you will start experimentting with bits and pieces of a tune. I found that true when I was starting on my journey as a Scruggs style player. The simplest arrangements just didn't sound "right" or "good" to my ears, so I tried substituting things here and there to make it sound "better" to my ears. Nothing too complex, because simple is about the best I can do.

At some point you might consider getting the Davis book "Splitting the Licks". It takes well known tunes and gives you different arrangments ranging from simple (melody only) to complex (like with added embellishments such as HO, PO and slides). The idea is that by analyzing the different arrangements you will get to the point where you can improvise while playing and/or write your own arrangements.

bill t - Posted - 01/23/2022:  09:43:43


Do you know about Russell Sawler's tabs on Bluegrassoutlet.com? One of the things he sells
is a book of tabs for the J. D. Crowe breaks on the Bluegrass Album Band recordings.

Old Hickory - Posted - 02/03/2022:  20:38:39


quote:

Originally posted by arlum

Are their any Bluegrass Banjo Tab books that are the true "as originally recorded" type? ... Even if it takes five times as long I'd rather know for sure that the Tab I'm learning from the first time will result in my playing it exactly the way any great banjo players in the audience know it should be played. None of that, "He's doing so & so's easy version" or "When he learns it the right way he could be a darn fine player to listen to". 






Richard, I've been meaning to reply to this for days and never got around to it. And tonight I realized you've also posted about having just recently started on banjo, acquiring your wonderful Davis Reno 75, and asking about capoing and not capoing . . . which now makes me want to ask even more than I did 10 days ago:  Where and when are you going to be playing in front of great banjo players who will know exactly which or whose version of any song you're playing? And why do you think they will judge you for that or even care?



In my experience, great players know there's not any one version of any tune that's "exactly the way...it should be played."  Professional players don't play anything except highly composed pieces the same way every time.  The greats are improvisers.  Their well known -- or even only -- recording of any particular tune or solo is likely to represent how they played it in that one take on that one day as it is the way they worked it out note-for-note and intended.



And even if there are pros who did play their own pieces the same way all the time, that doesn't mean the rest of us have to. There's too much creativity floating around the banjo world for us to be locked into one version of anything.



And what about traditional tunes like Salt Creek, Bill Cheatham, Little Maggie. They have no composer. No owner. No one to say what's right.



I've been playing for nearly 50 years. I don't qualify as great, but I am experienced. Hearing other players in a jam or local band, I'd much prefer to hear a simple but appropriate solo played cleanly, in time, with good tone and taste than some attempt at flash the player can't execute. OK, I will give a player credit for stretching themselves. I like hearing good ideas, whatever the source.



All the previous being said, I do have some arrangements of songs that I try to play the same way every time. These tend to be solo performance pieces I've specifically worked out. I'd call them "composed" if they were my own compositions. And in my playing years with bands, I'd have some pieces that came out close to the same most times. But I'm mostly an improvisor and so on a lot of material, I didn't know exactly what I was going to play. Often enough what came out wasn't what I was trying to do. 



And I did that with no apologies to any great banjo players in the audience who were expecting otherwise.

Sheenjack - Posted - 02/04/2022:  08:09:25


Alison Browns Tab Book is an accurate transcribe of her Simple Pleasures album. Not for the faint of heart.



 

Old Hickory - Posted - 02/04/2022:  08:55:00


quote:

Originally posted by Sheenjack

Alison Browns Tab Book is an accurate transcribe of her Simple Pleasures album. Not for the faint of heart.






Glad I got my copy before it sold out.

arlum - Posted - 02/04/2022:  09:30:30


Ken,
I doubt I'll ever play in a public venue other than with friends or family at home or one of their houses or possibly a campground. This banjo is just about owning something I've always wanted that will give me good fun and something to apply myself to when I finally retire. I know I'm over thinking everything involved. I just don't want to make any false starts. I've been working with lesson books and will probably move to online lessons at some point. At some points I find something that seems to point in different directions that have little in common with each other and I hesitate to move on until I get clarification on what I'm stumbling over. In the early '70s I worked as a guitar teacher first at a local mom & pop music store and then through a company providing in home lessons. Our instructions used easy songs to play at the beginning of the lesson plan but we chose to never offer easy versions of harder songs. When you attained a playing level equal to the task you would then learn whatever pieces your time and practice had elevated you to. Short cuts seldom resulted in something you'd be proud of. Students had lots of questions. The guitar was so popular that even long before the internet there were tons of sources to get information from. The biggest shock of my recent banjo purchase is the limitation of source materials to learn from. The material I've found, for the most part, have been very good. It's just surprising to me how little there is compared say to the guitar. Because I've always loved the banjo maybe I just assumed that a lot of people did. I'm Missouri born and raised so that might be part of it. There are a lot of Missourians who love the banjo.

I guess it was a bit of an eye opener when after searching all the large music dealer websites, banjo specific dealer websites, and then on line book stores like Amazon, etc. that I didn't come up with more than 40 or 50 banjo books. Not just lesson books but also history, construction, etc. I've probably got over 100 guitar books in my studio and doubt I own 1% of those available. It just seems unfair that there isn't more interest in the banjo. I guess it's just one more example of my personal taste and the taste of most folks not being in agreement. I'm going to learn to play this instrument and I'm going to enjoy myself both during the learning phase and then well into retirement.

Thank you Ken for your interest and observations. I can see I've already stumbled more than once but I'm determined to keep at this new banjo phase of my life. I've listened forever and now I want to play.

Rick

AGACNP - Posted - 02/04/2022:  11:41:27


quote:

Originally posted by arlum

Ken,

I doubt I'll ever play in a public venue other than with friends or family at home or one of their houses or possibly a campground. This banjo is just about owning something I've always wanted that will give me good fun and something to apply myself to when I finally retire. I know I'm over thinking everything involved. I just don't want to make any false starts. I've been working with lesson books and will probably move to online lessons at some point. At some points I find something that seems to point in different directions that have little in common with each other and I hesitate to move on until I get clarification on what I'm stumbling over. In the early '70s I worked as a guitar teacher first at a local mom & pop music store and then through a company providing in home lessons. Our instructions used easy songs to play at the beginning of the lesson plan but we chose to never offer easy versions of harder songs. When you attained a playing level equal to the task you would then learn whatever pieces your time and practice had elevated you to. Short cuts seldom resulted in something you'd be proud of. Students had lots of questions. The guitar was so popular that even long before the internet there were tons of sources to get information from. The biggest shock of my recent banjo purchase is the limitation of source materials to learn from. The material I've found, for the most part, have been very good. It's just surprising to me how little there is compared say to the guitar. Because I've always loved the banjo maybe I just assumed that a lot of people did. I'm Missouri born and raised so that might be part of it. There are a lot of Missourians who love the banjo.



I guess it was a bit of an eye opener when after searching all the large music dealer websites, banjo specific dealer websites, and then on line book stores like Amazon, etc. that I didn't come up with more than 40 or 50 banjo books. Not just lesson books but also history, construction, etc. I've probably got over 100 guitar books in my studio and doubt I own 1% of those available. It just seems unfair that there isn't more interest in the banjo. I guess it's just one more example of my personal taste and the taste of most folks not being in agreement. I'm going to learn to play this instrument and I'm going to enjoy myself both during the learning phase and then well into retirement.



Thank you Ken for your interest and observations. I can see I've already stumbled more than once but I'm determined to keep at this new banjo phase of my life. I've listened forever and now I want to play.



Rick






Richard,



My observation is that there just aren't as many folks as interested in banjos as there are guitars, thus the relative dearth of available printed information about them (styles, instruction, history, construction, and so on).



This site contains a wealth of information (styles, instruction, history, construction, and so on) from reliable sources. I only can wish this had been available when I started out, but I was stuck (as many here were) with slowing down the 33 RPM to 16 1/2 RPM and figuring out the notes one by one, transposing them back up the octave in pitch that was lost with the slower speed.



Enjoy the ride...


Edited by - AGACNP on 02/04/2022 11:41:59

arlum - Posted - 02/04/2022:  14:50:41


Thank You All!
Rick

gcpicken - Posted - 02/06/2022:  07:58:38


quote:

Originally posted by bill t

Do you know about Russell Sawler's tabs on Bluegrassoutlet.com? One of the things he sells

is a book of tabs for the J. D. Crowe breaks on the Bluegrass Album Band recordings.




I second Russell Sawler. Here is a link. bluegrassoutlet.com

He is also a very nice guy, and will do custom tab (pdf with a TEF file) for you if there is a song, backup, intro, break, etc. you want (obviously a small fee for custom tab). You can send him the recording or link to it, and tell him the time-stamps you want tabbed.


Edited by - gcpicken on 02/06/2022 08:00:23

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