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 ARCHIVED TOPIC: B&D Serenader Silver Bell - looking for more info


Please note this is an archived topic, so it is locked and unable to be replied to. You may, however, start a new topic and refer to this topic with a link: http://www.banjohangout.org/archive/372667

fraser__ - Posted - 02/12/2021:  06:30:40


Hi,



My uncle recently got this banjo and we were wondering if anyone had any information on it; worth today, age, all original parts etc?

It had a Gretsch inscribed tail piece, leading me to believe it's not vintage but we're not sure.





Plays great and is in great condition



Thanks in advance for your input



trying to post photos..


Edited by - fraser__ on 02/13/2021 08:54:57




beezaboy - Posted - 02/12/2021:  07:33:04


I looked at your photos and yes it was made by Gretsch.
We'll need photos of the back of the banjo - back of peghead to see tuners - back of rim to see resonator and a side view so we can see the flange.
Your additional photos will help but not entirely.
You should remove the resonator which is attached thru the lip of the flange either by little screws or with thumb screws. Resonator goes back same way it came off. Sometimes there is a little pin in the rim at the heel of the neck which helps to center the resonator with a little notch in the lip of the flange but it is not essential to replacing the resonator.
Once the resonator is off you can see the serial number stamped on the dowel.
Now we're getting someplace. The serial number could be prefaced by "Made In USA" in gold. The "USA" is part of the serial number which we'll need to try to date your uncle's banjo.
Then a side view of the inside of the rim so we can see the tone ring.
My sense of the banjo tells me it will be an archtop tone ring but better look anyway it could be an earlier build flathead tone ring.

Bob Smakula - Posted - 02/13/2021:  05:08:22


quote:

Originally posted by fraser__

Hi,



My uncle recently got this banjo and we were wondering if anyone had any information on it; worth today, age, all original parts etc?

It had a Gretsch inscribed tail piece, leading me to believe it's not vintage but we're not sure.





Plays great and is in great condition



Thanks in advance for your input



 



trying to post photos..






Post your photos directly to the forum page. THey come out bigger and you will get more quality comments from the banjo history brain trust.



 



Bob Smakula

fraser__ - Posted - 02/13/2021:  08:31:07


Hi beezaboy ,

Thanks for the info!
I uploaded more pictures but I don't think I'll be able to open it without my uncles permission just yet..

fraser__ - Posted - 02/13/2021:  08:33:07


quote:

Originally posted by Bob Smakula





Post your photos directly to the forum page. THey come out bigger and you will get more quality comments from the banjo history brain trust.



 



Bob Smakula






Hey, still trying to figure the website out.. thanks for the tip!

beezaboy - Posted - 02/13/2021:  11:29:01


fraser - If you are uncomfortable removing the resonator - no worry. I was just trying to see if we could pin down the date of manufacture a little better and perhaps catch a look at the bottom of the rim to see how it was made in your dowel photo. By looking at your photos up on this page I can see the archtop tone ring which began in about the mid-1950's. So, just estimating your uncle's Serenader looks to be very late 1950's up to mid 1960's. I've seen the Gretsch latch tailpiece most often on early1960's to mid 1960's Gretsch/Bacons. This Serenader is missing the knee mute which is common as many tenor banjoists did not like it and removed it. Attached is an undated Gretsch/Bacon flyer but clearly from 1963 which depicts and describes the Gretsch B&D Serenader. Finally, there is no definitive Gretsch/Bacon serial number date chart and efforts to date by serial number are educated estimates by folks interested in the Gretsch/Bacons (like me) and who collect Gretsch serial numbers.


fraser__ - Posted - 02/13/2021:  12:48:13


Hi beezaboy

I didn't expect this much information, my uncle will be delighted!
Thanks again for your input, very much appreciated.

If my uncle ever does get a look inside, I'll update this post but I think he'll be happy with all this info you've provided!

Fraser

fraser__ - Posted - 04/26/2021:  04:21:45


quote:

Originally posted by beezaboy

fraser - If you are uncomfortable removing the resonator - no worry. I was just trying to see if we could pin down the date of manufacture a little better and perhaps catch a look at the bottom of the rim to see how it was made in your dowel photo. By looking at your photos up on this page I can see the archtop tone ring which began in about the mid-1950's. So, just estimating your uncle's Serenader looks to be very late 1950's up to mid 1960's. I've seen the Gretsch latch tailpiece most often on early1960's to mid 1960's Gretsch/Bacons. This Serenader is missing the knee mute which is common as many tenor banjoists did not like it and removed it. Attached is an undated Gretsch/Bacon flyer but clearly from 1963 which depicts and describes the Gretsch B&D Serenader. Finally, there is no definitive Gretsch/Bacon serial number date chart and efforts to date by serial number are educated estimates by folks interested in the Gretsch/Bacons (like me) and who collect Gretsch serial numbers.






 



Hi,



My uncle managed to have a look inside the banjo, and this is the model number it has: 25098

Not sure if this helps figure out more information, just posting here for anyones interest. :)



Thanks,

Fraser

 

beezaboy - Posted - 04/26/2021:  05:05:33


Wow that is a rare one - 25098.
I have only documented one 25XXX.
Based on my personal list of Serenader serial numbers and estimates of Serenader model build dates I think your uncle's banjo is 1957.

fraser__ - Posted - 05/04/2021:  03:41:27


quote:

Originally posted by beezaboy

Wow that is a rare one - 25098.

I have only documented one 25XXX.

Based on my personal list of Serenader serial numbers and estimates of Serenader model build dates I think your uncle's banjo is 1957.






 



Oh wow... that's incredible!

I was just off the phone with him and he's very pleased, he didn't think it was that old.



I don't suppose you'd be able to estimate the worth of it?

My Uncle's a long time banjo player and he'll most definitely hold onto it but just out of curiosity?



Thank you,



Fraser

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