finger-picker - Posted - 02/12/2021:  05:55:01

I'm starting to read sheet music in order to play classical pieces such as the Gavotte snippets in the attached images. I figured it'd be easier in the long run to read off the sheet than trying to mess with tab software (I haven't done much with TablEdit or related software). I am curious about what various symbols and notation are that I've come across thus far. I put numbers next to the items (see attached images) and will list them here as well:

1. A dot over a note - is this to play the note staccato, or disconnected, such as when a string is picked without a slur? 


2. A.: A curved line connecting two or more subsequent notes - this is a legato or slur indicator I believe, to play 2 notes using a pull off, hammer on, or slide, depending on if the first note is higher or lower in pitch. Correct? (I understand that a tie looks similar but usually connects 2 or more of the same note in which denotes a timing function.)
   
   
   
   • 2.B.: A slur from B to A cannot be done using second string to third string 2nd fret in standard G tuning, unless I did an alternate string hammer on. Should I just ignore this slur or should I consider doing third string 4th fret B to 2nd fret pull off in order to maintain how it is written? 
   
   
   
   


3. A dot below a note - is this a staccato as well or something else?


4. A comma on the top line of the staff - is this a section break or something else? 


5. A.: A miniature quarter or eighth note next to a note - I believe these are grace notes, to be played in the same time duration as the note they're next to?
   
   
   
   • 5.B.: In the case of the pictured grace note next to the 5, is the eighth grace note next to the first note of the eighth note string considered a triplet? 
   
   
   
   


6. A.: Bb is notated - if the key is in G with F# as its only sharp, why wouldn't the B flat be listed as A# instead? I figured it's important to preserve the sharp notation across all notes, or does this not matter...
   
   
   
   • 6.B.: Is the Bb considered a passing tone since Bb is not part of the Key of G? 
   
   
   • 6.C.: In all instances where F is listed on the staff, is it implied that it's actually F#? (Also see question 7 on this)
   
   
   
   


7. Why are there some F's without sharps and some F's with sharps, i.e. Is the sharp listed on the top line of the key signature only pertain to F's that are on the top line of the staff? 


8. Again this appears to be a passing tone, but it's listed as C# vs. Db. To me it would make more sense to list all accidental passing tones either just as sharps or just as flats, but maybe there's something else going on here? 


9. In image 2: italicized "tr" - does this stand for tremolo and if so how would it be played for this particular segment? 


10. A ' > ' symbol above a note?


11. An italicized lower case "p" below a note?


12. An italicized lower case "f" below a note?

Thanks!

Gavotte1

Gavotte2

BigFiveChord - Posted - 02/12/2021:  06:14:58

(1) Staccato

(2) Legato, notes should be played together as a phrase (sometimes called a "slur" indication)

(3) Also staccato

(4) It's a "breath mark" indicating the end of a phrase and a good place to breathe or reverse bow direction if applicable

(5) Grace notes, some styles of music play them before the beat, some play them on the beat

(6) People make different sharp/flat choices for different reasons, you can have both in one piece

(7) The F# in the key signature is good for all Fs. The arranger or notater might have threw some extras in to help remind the performer.

(8) Again, it's just a choice.

(9) Trill

(10) Accent

(11) Dynamic indication: piano (soft)

(12) Dynamic indication: loud (forte)

Edited by - BigFiveChord on 02/12/2021 06:23:36

Joel Hooks - Posted - 02/12/2021:  06:18:19

Hi Dan, while not "classical" I would recommend you get the book "Mel Bay's Banjo Method, Concert Style" by Frank Bradbury. Even though the book was intended for nylon strings and bare fingers, you can use it with picks and wire.

It will teach you, in graded lessons, all you need to know and the answers to your above questions. Additionally it will provide you with banjo specific edits to use to make reading easier. Things like right and left hand fingering, position, bar, and position bar markings, etc.. These edits have over 150 years of tradition and constant use. It will also teach you a system of alternate right hand fingering with will aid in playing strains like those you posted.

Prior to WW2 the banjo was a noted instrument and music was shared, sold, and recorded using notation. Shifts in popular music, the rise of chord chards, and the rise of "back to basics" folk music kicked notation out. Now banjoists are their own worst enemies, regularly discouraging literacy in favor of ear playing or play by number tab.

Congrats on choosing the path of literacy over tab!

Bradbury also published a book in 1926 that has much of the same info but is not as well graded. It is still excellent and you may find it for free here..

archive.org/details/bradburymo...dforbanjo

Other books you might find helpful are:

archive.org/details/TheImprove...dForBanjo

archive.org/details/ezmethodho...armstrong

archive.org/details/Wm.C.Stahl...njoMethod

archive.org/details/NewtonsCon.../mode/2up

archive.org/details/TuitionInB.../mode/2up

archive.org/details/DallasMode...anjoEllis

archive.org/details/essexcamme.../mode/2up

Joel Hooks - Posted - 02/12/2021:  06:50:42

...sorry, position, barre, and position barre, markings.

A book I left out that does a good job showing the banjo specific markings for reference is "The Banjo and How To Play It" by Emile Grimshaw. This book is too fast moving in my opinion, but makes a clear reference. Grimshaw also teaches a sort of system of chord groupings which is helpful for faster reading.

It can be found here.

classic-banjo.ning.com/page/tutor-books

There is a modern version of this that is in tab. I have not seen a copy, but I don't think it would be any help to you for notation.

Texasbanjo - Posted - 02/12/2021:  07:06:45

Dan, you can probably find lots of free music theory online. Just Google music theory and then look up the information you need to know from that source.

I have several music theory books and all of them go into what you're asking and explain it where it's very understandable.

G Edward Porgie - Posted - 02/12/2021:  07:10:09

I will only add a couple of remarks to Jon's excellent response.

A grace note is usually shorter than the note it precedes, although its exact length is somewhat open to the performer. These "grace notes" are generally decorative, and can be played with some variation or, if they don't work well on a particular instrument, can sometimes even be eliminated.

The comma is a break, and sometimes can be an actual brief interuption of the steady meter. Again, this can be open to a performer's interpretaion.

The accidental Bb in this piece appears to be due to a brief key change from G major to G minor. That is the reason why the Bb comes into play. The F# notaion is superfluous and somwhat confusing and should have been left out (in fact, two measures later the phrase is repeated without the sharp). The C# accidental is another brief interlude--it appears to be part of an A7 chord, the dominant of the D7, which leads back to the key of G--a typical use of the "circle of fifths" (A7,D7,G).

G Edward Porgie - Posted - 02/12/2021:  07:24:53

One other thing to note: A "slur" line doesn't mean you have to play the two notes as a slide, hammer-on, or pull-off. It simply means that the notes involved should transition one to the other as smoothly as possible.

Ira Gitlin - Posted - 02/12/2021:  07:25:28

Perhaps that redundantly notated F# was meant to tell you, "Hey, I know it sounds like we're in G-minor at this point, but don't forget that this is an F#, not F-natural."

Perhaps. But yes, it is redundant and unnecessary.

mmuussiiccaall - Posted - 02/12/2021:  07:38:13

The F# is what is called a courtesy accidental.

250gibson - Posted - 02/12/2021:  09:22:20

It should also be of note that the interpretation and execution of the articulations depends a lot on the genre of music. For example, staccato in classical music usually indicates the note is about half duration as written. A jazz player would play a lot shorter staccato. It would be played more like a classical players staccatisimo

finger-picker - Posted - 02/12/2021:  09:52:22

quote:

---

Originally posted by Texasbanjo

Dan, you can probably find lots of free music theory online. Just Google music theory and then look up the information you need to know from that source.



I have several music theory books and all of them go into what you're asking and explain it where it's very understandable.

---

That's exactly what I'm doing in this post, but in a more community-minded way :)

bcubrich - Posted - 02/12/2021:  10:13:09

John response was great. I would only add one more thing. When there is the curved line between notes that's a slur if the notes are different and you are playing a violin or a trumpet or so on.



If the music was notated for plectrum instruments, however, that symbol is the standard notation symbol for a hammer or pull-off when connecting just two notes. It can still be a slur if over many notes.



Also, if the curved lines connects two of the same note, then that is a tie, and means that you should hold the note for the length of the first plus the second note. That is really common in jazz, when playing syncopated quarter notes.

imgur.com/xWWnPL3 imgur.com/xWWnPL3 imgur.com/xWWnPL3 imgur.com/xWWnPL3 Here is an example score for guitar.

bcubrich - Posted - 02/12/2021:  10:18:18

Also, incidentally, I have been looking for duet partners who can read, and have a ton of duet materials. These duets would work with banjo reading top line, and guitar on bottom.

archive.org/details/gavall-han.../mode/2up

archive.org/details/gavall-bac.../mode/2up

Texasbanjo - Posted - 02/12/2021:  11:10:16

quote:

---

Originally posted by dan_the_man

quote:

---

Originally posted by Texasbanjo

Dan, you can probably find lots of free music theory online. Just Google music theory and then look up the information you need to know from that source.



I have several music theory books and all of them go into what you're asking and explain it where it's very understandable.

---

That's exactly what I'm doing in this post, but in a more community-minded way :)

---

And it's fine to ask questions of members, that's why we're here.   It's just with a book or information from the internet, you can refer back to it at any time, read it, underline or highlight it.    My music theory books have yellow highlights all through them and stickies on pages where I need to check back occasionally.

I was in no way meaning to say you shouldn't ask for help, but just another way to have even more information available. 

G Edward Porgie - Posted - 02/12/2021:  14:24:46

quote:

---

Originally posted by mmuussiiccaall

The F# is what is called a courtesy accidental.

---

If the transcriber felt courteous, he should have used that F# in all cases where the phrase occurred, which he didn't. That makes it confusing, which is anything but courteous.

I will also point out that in the harmonic G minor, the dominant chord is still D major (or D7), and does not use the F natural. 

Edited by - G Edward Porgie on 02/12/2021 14:35:22

Old Hickory - Posted - 02/12/2021:  21:37:57

quote:

---

Originally posted by dan_the_man

8. Again this appears to be a passing tone, but it's listed as C# vs. Db. To me it would make more sense to list all accidental passing tones either just as sharps or just as flats, but maybe there's something else going on here?

---

George answered,  but did not emphasize the point, that what's going on is note naming consistent with the convention for a key or chord that may be happening at a particular time.

As he said, the C# is part of an A7 chord, the notes of which are A C# E G.    Making the note D flat would not signal A7 to anyone who knows the rules for chord construction.

As he also mentioned, the B flat is part of a brief change to G minor. The note at that location in the G minor scale is B flat and not A#, because A natural already exists in G minor and each letter is used just once. And, again, calling the note A# would not signal the change of key or tonality to anyone who knows their scales.

There are other conventions for when notes are called "x" sharp or "x" flat, but I sure don't know what they are. You might want to become familiar with them if you're going to get deep into transcribing classical material.