wilbanjo - Posted - 09/03/2020:  19:41:53

Help me settle or understand something . I'm just a banjo picker :) A piano player told me this song is in A . Why would it be in A ? I know in A  chords are A D E , in D Chords are D G A .

Two Highways Chords and Lyrics

 

mirwin - Posted - 09/03/2020:  19:59:20

One clue is that most songs will end on the 1 chord -- and this song ends on A. The second clue is that the chord progression in the first line is 4 5 1 if the song is in A. If it was in D, the progression would be 1 2 5. A less likely progression.

I suspect that the confusion lies in that the song begins on a 4 chord.

I'm not familiar with the song but that's what it looks like to me.

Mike

G Edward Porgie - Posted - 09/03/2020:  20:11:32

There are more than just the A, D, an E chords in the key of A. If you don't understand that, I don't think you will understand why this piece is in that key. The E to A finish is a dominant to tonic cadence, probably the strongest finish there is. The fact that it ends on the A chord is also a strong indicator of key of A.



I could point out that even though the B7 doesn't seem to be in A, it's merely a transition chord, part of the "Circle of Fifths" and is quite common, as it is the dominant of the E chord, which then leads to the A.



I fear that because you don't appear to know that the key of A isn't just D,E, and A, that you are probably even more confused now. I suggest you find a book on theory and harmony and study it. Those who write such books can usually explain things far better and more completely than anyone can in a paragraph or two., and you can study at your own pace.

Edited by - G Edward Porgie on 09/03/2020 20:17:10

rickhayes - Posted - 09/03/2020:  20:15:03

Just listened to the song by AKUS. They do it in B. You would have to capo at 2 using the chords you have to get it in B. Uncapoed it would be in A. That just confirms what your piano player said. The why is that the song resolves to the A chord, which is at the end of each chorus.

Greg Denton - Posted - 09/04/2020:  04:42:05

The song is in the key of A but it uses a couple of chords that aren't in the key of A to add tension, color, and interest to the chord progression. There are a couple of very common tricks to do this, and this song uses both of them.

There are 7 notes in a major scale
Do Re Mi Fa So La Ti (and then Do again)
and there's a chord associated with each step in the scale (usually numbered in Roman numerals - UPPER CASE for major chords, lower case for minor chords)
In a major scale the pattern of chords looks like this
I - ii - iii - IV - V or V7 - vi - vii dim
in the key of A that would be these chords:
A - Bm - C#m - D - E - F#m - G#dim

the song you posted borrows some chords from the "parallel minor" key of Am (that is the minor scale that shares the same root note of A)
The chords of minor keys (compared to the major scale) look like this numerically:
i - ii dim - bIII - iv - v - bVI - bVII
in the key of Am that would be these chords
Am - B dim - C - Dm - Em - F - G
(you'll notice the song you posted borrows the F and the G chord -briefly- from the key of Am)

The V or V7 chord in a major key is a very important chord - it's the homesick sounding chord that wants to go home (to the "I" chord).
Think of the I chord as home (where things are at rest and resolved), the IV chord as chord that leaves home (builds a sense of adventurous tension) and the V chord as the homesick chord (unstable tension that wants to resolve home).
Their technical names are Tonic (I), Subdominant (IV), and Dominant (V)

The song you posted borrows the B7 chord from the key of E. This is a very common trick to borrow a Dominant chord from another key to "pull" towards and chord that IS in the key. They're called "Secondary Dominant" chords.
In the song you posted the B7 creates a tension that pulls toward the E chord (although in this instance the songs goes to the IV chord (D) before it gets to the E.

But most of the chords used belong to the key of A and the song resolves to the A major chord. I suspect that the melody may use notes that are only from the key of A and the "borrowed chords" contain the same notes that are being sung while they're played. It's a fairly common trick (a little less so in bluegrass) to add surprise, tension, color, and movement to the harmony of a song.

Esus2 chord is just an E chord with the middle note (G#) lowered temporarily (suspended) to F# - another tension building trick. The sus4 chord (where the middle note of a chord is raised a half-step) is actually more common. If you see a suspended chord that doesn't designate 2 or 4, it's usually a sus4 chord.

Texasbanjo - Posted - 09/04/2020:  04:44:36

It is a bit unusual, but there are songs that start off with the 4 chord instead of the 1 chord. First time I came across that was when I was learning Gold Watch and Chain. It starts off with the 4 chord and for a long time I just couldn't figure it out because I thought it was in a different key. Once someone explained that it started off with a 4 chord, then the lightbulb went off and I could play it just fine. Weird what our minds do to us sometimes.

EulalieBlue - Posted - 09/04/2020:  05:08:18

It seems to me it leans toward A Dorian. Modes can be confusing to those who don't quite grasp normal tonal harmony, but an understanding of the modes is essential to understanding the theory of music for the banjo.

Greg Denton - Posted - 09/04/2020:  05:55:59

quote:

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Originally posted by EulalieBlue

It seems to me it leans toward A Dorian. Modes can be confusing to those who don't quite grasp normal tonal harmony, but an understanding of the modes is essential to understanding the theory of music for the banjo.

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Except A Dorian is a minor key

The chords that belong to A Dorian are

Am -  Bm  -  C  -  D  -  Em  -  F#dim -  G

This song is structured primarily around  A  -  D  -   E   -  F#m   the most common chords of the key of A major (A Ionian). And it resolves to an A Major chord (not Am).

It borrows from A Aeolian (which is the natural Am scale) - That's where the F and G chords come from. (notice that in A Dorian the "F" chord would be F#diminished)

And it borrows the B7 from the key of E.

EulalieBlue - Posted - 09/04/2020:  06:42:47

You'll note that my sentence said "leans toward A Dorian," which is a mode and not a key, despite the inclination to subject modes to tonal harmonic analyis. The beautiful thing about modes (historical, not as in modern jazz and R&R) is that they are flexible and harmonies are less defined by thirds, and the further back in time one traces them the more interesting they become. Most of the music I play makes more sense as derived from the hexachord and its many possible mutations.

Ira Gitlin - Posted - 09/04/2020:  08:07:09

quote:

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Originally posted by mirwin

One clue is that most songs will end on the 1 chord -- and this song ends on A.



 

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To elaborate slightly, when you listen to it, the song sets up expectations that are only satisfied when you get back to that A chord.

Here's a great video of AKUS playing this song, from back in 1990 or 1991, when Alison Brown was playing banjo with them.



youtube.com/watch?v=ljiQ7MnwrvQ

davidppp - Posted - 09/04/2020:  09:15:30

I find it interesting that expectations and "satisfaction" are culture-dependent.

Music theory provides a language that allows writing and talking about music.  But there are plenty of musicians who achieved greatness without the aid of any such structure or knowledge.

Standard music notation is well-suited to instruments that play one note at a time and/or have a unique way to produce a particular pitch.  Even then, a lot is missing from the page.  (Just listen to a MIDI rendition.)  Plucked string instruments, where you fret or finger the strings, and often play chords, i.e., more than two notes at a time, are particularly at odds with standard notation.  That's why we have TAB.  It still only encodes the MIDI version, and there's still a lot missing.

Based on his not-too-shabby playing (see youtube.com/watch?v=3K5ecU_VJs...=emb_logo ), I'd say that the original poster of this thread knows a lot more than the I, IV, and V chords.  And I venture he learned it in the traditional fashion -- by listening and watching.  (OK, maybe some TABs were in there, too.)