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 Playing Advice: Bluegrass (Scruggs) Styles
 ARCHIVED TOPIC: Backup over non-bluegrass chord progressions


Please note this is an archived topic, so it is locked and unable to be replied to. You may, however, start a new topic and refer to this topic with a link: http://www.banjohangout.org/archive/363899

watercarving - Posted - 05/11/2020:  05:18:14


I'm working on a song that has the progression of Gm - F. I'm trying to spruce my backup on it beyond vamping but I really don't have any good ideas. How would you tackle this?

A link to the song is below. I'm trying to follow him but having a hard time figuring out what he is doing.

youtube.com/watch?v=5NkMKxUMX4I

Thank you,

John

TheChaplain - Posted - 05/11/2020:  05:26:02


Try using the Chordify app it is awesome. If the song you want to learn is on youtube, then more than likely someone has already put the chords on chordify.

TheChaplain - Posted - 05/11/2020:  05:32:10


The progression is D - Gm - F in a few places there is a C and a Bflat m

watercarving - Posted - 05/11/2020:  05:51:24


You are correct. The most used part is the Gm - F. That's why I was focusing on interesting backup over the those two chords. I want to do more than just vamp.

JimmyBobby - Posted - 05/11/2020:  06:29:45


Use those chords that you are vamping and just roll around on them. Maybe learn the inversions up the neck and do the first half of the measure over a low shape and slide up into the high shape. Inside out rolls, forward reverse, it really doesn't matter as long as the rolls are in time with the chord changes. The possibilities are limitless

mmuussiiccaall - Posted - 05/11/2020:  09:00:50


Earl's ears told him to add notes that are up 2 frets and down 3 frets from the root.

Richard Hauser - Posted - 05/18/2020:  06:26:01


Some websites, Mike Hedding's for example, sell tabs for "rolling backup" for different keys.
Those tabs and videos should give you a better idea of what you can do. Go to Youtube and watch some of those videos.

Richard Hauser - Posted - 05/20/2020:  06:43:00


When I want to see the chord progression for a tune, I often log on to the "Ultimate Guitar" website. I subscribe to the site. I get the chord progression, chord diagrams, words, and sometimes the guitar strumming pattern. It has helped me add new chords to my playing repertoire.

mmuussiiccaall - Posted - 05/20/2020:  11:09:04


90% of what you do with a banjo has to do with your ears. Study ear-training, it’ll help everything else

chuckv97 - Posted - 05/20/2020:  11:21:01


I only hear GM and F throughout the whole song. Forward roll those two chords to give it drive. Slide 2 to 5 on the 4th string, then 5-3-1,,5-3-1 for the Gm. 4-3,,5-2-1,,4-3-1 for the F chord. (for each measure) Avoid the open 2nd string.


Edited by - chuckv97 on 05/20/2020 11:24:35

chuckv97 - Posted - 05/20/2020:  15:26:14


quote:

Originally posted by chuckv97

I only hear GM and F throughout the whole song. Forward roll those two chords to give it drive. Slide 2 to 5 on the 4th string, then 5-3-1,,5-3-1 for the Gm. 4-3,,5-2-1,,4-3-1 for the F chord. (for each measure) Avoid the open 2nd string.






Oops, that should be Gm, not GM

SteveMurtha - Posted - 05/23/2020:  16:07:26


I'm with Chuck. I only hear the two chords, although the melody players do some chord substitutions, especially the mando player. There's some fine picking there, even if the singer has a little trouble with his entrances. Suggestion: why not start by picking out as much as you can of what the banjo player is doing? He's doing a nice job.

Old Hickory - Posted - 05/24/2020:  12:02:40


quote:

Originally posted by watercarving

I'm trying to follow him but having a hard time figuring out what he is doing.






Main thing to do is avoid 2nd string open! 



When rolling down the neck, start a forward-backward with slide 3-5 on 4th string, hitting 3rd string as you finish the slide.  I'm not going to tab out any specific roll. Just play with hitting various strings while avoiding 2nd string open. Why? Because that B note turns the chord into G Major and you want B minor with a B-flat.  Experiment with the 4th string open, fretted at 5, fretted at 3 sliding back into 5.



You can also use a basic forward roll + forward-backward roll exercise pattern:  3-1-5-3-1-5-3-1-4-3-1-5-1-3-4-1 



For a bluesy-modal sound, occasionally on the backside of the forward-backward roll fret 2nd string at 1 followed by 3rd string at 3.



For the F chord, you're home free. Do any roll you know.  To add a sense of motion and again contribute to the modal sound occasionally play the 1st string open and add the 2nd string 1st fret/3rd string 3rd fret combo to the F chord.



Up the neck, experiment with the G minor at 7-8-8   (D-G-Bflat) and the F at 5-6-7.



For more ideas, watch Kyle Tuttle's lesson on playing in B-flat in open G tuning:



 





Open Bb Lesson from Kyle Tuttle on Vimeo.



Stuff that works against B-flat will also work against G-minor.



Edited to add: Maybe not eerything in the lesson applies. You'll have to figure that out and use what works.



Also spend time with this G blues/B-flat pentatonic lick taught by John Boulding. You can play the whole lick or parts of it. In fact, break it down into parts and you'll discover there are cool sounds to be made at each of the positions. Modify the ending to flow into an F chord. Experiment.




Edited by - Old Hickory on 05/24/2020 12:07:11

Old Hickory - Posted - 05/24/2020:  13:55:18


So I see Chuck suggested everything I did four days ago. Sorry about that.

stanger - Posted - 05/25/2020:  18:22:33


It helps to know the key the song is played in.
That tune is in the key of Gm. The basic chords in Gm are: Gm, Bb, Cm, and F.

Billy is using a capo on the 3rd, which makes his Bb chord open, and makes the Gm chord finger like Em on the guitar. Playing backup on the banjo allows you to use other, lower chord shapes on the open neck, except for the Bb, which would be the same major chord, found on the same 3rd fret of the banjo as on the guitar.
regards,
stanger

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