Banjo Hangout - Playing Advice: Clawhammer and Old-Time Styles Forum Feed

Is there a book that explains the history of old time tunes?

eric@banjohangout.org — Thu, 23 May 2013 17:54:05 CST

Howdy,

Does anyone know if there is there a book or another resource that explains the history of old time tunes? Like where they originated, what they are about, and so forth.

Thanks!

Miles Krassen and Others at the Folk Festival

eric@banjohangout.org — Wed, 22 May 2013 19:05:59 CST

The Albuquerque Folk Festival is a one day event (there is camping the night before and the night of), but on June 1, 2013 I'll be heading to the Balloon Fiesta Park for a wonderful day filled with music, friendship, workshops, performances, and more.

Miles Krassen will be appearing in the 10:30 slot - for one solid hour folks will be able to hear this wonderful historian/musican/fiddler talk and play with some of his friends including some well-known Banjo Hangout players.

If you are in the area, you might want to come just for this one hour event - and there's lots more for just a $ 20 fee. Look it up online here:
http://www.abqfolkfest.org

You can email me for more information or for molre specific answers to your specific questions.

Best A-Scale?

eric@banjohangout.org — Wed, 22 May 2013 15:46:04 CST

What are your opinions on a-scale banjos as far as the maker?

Edit: Best ones under $750

Been thinking about getting one, just can't afford one over $1000. Gotta love BAS (everyone's been here before )

Audience Participation

eric@banjohangout.org — Wed, 22 May 2013 14:43:31 CST

Hey Guy's

What songs get a great reaction from an audience, songs where the audience will sing along without being prompted songs that will motivate them to get up and dance?

Songs that are happy.

ELEVATED 5TH STRING BRIDGE

eric@banjohangout.org — Wed, 22 May 2013 12:58:02 CST

So.....I looked thru the posts and must have missed any topics on the use of an elevated 5th string bridge. I saw one advertised so I built one this weekend. I added @ 1/8" to a Grover bridge I had and that seemed to raise the 5th string level with the others under the scoop. Other than that, does it hinder anything else I am not aware of at this time?

Thks for your time...

open C ?

eric@banjohangout.org — Wed, 22 May 2013 07:36:39 CST

This guy has some sweet claw going on, I worked on figuring it out by ear, and I can usually do that, just by repitition, but Im not getting it, he says open c , which I think is gCDCE , any ideas?

http://youtu.be/4mT52Y6L4DU

It Shread Kelly Clay Tech has it on his vids.

melody

eric@banjohangout.org — Wed, 22 May 2013 07:26:55 CST

This may seem like a dumb question but I am wanting to start coming up with my own arrangements, and im curious as to where most people get thier melody lines in clawhammer style. From Chords or scales? and what about accompanying singing?

Best sounding/playing custom banjos today?

eric@banjohangout.org — Tue, 21 May 2013 23:01:34 CST

I know this is a vast question and it's def left up to personal taste..but still I'd like some ideas or views rather on the custom open back banjos out there today..I realize that theirs probably 1000s of makers, but a few stand out to me, Ome, Enoch, Romero, Ramsey, Chuck Lee, these are the ones that really have my attention at the moment...anyways I have no access to these banjos other than listening to them on my phone or computer, and I'd like some insight on what everyone thinks about these banjos..I know all these banjos are spectacular and all have their on sound but I'd like to see if any stick out from the rest as far as tone and playability! Def like to hear from Mr. Zepp since I know he plays these different banjos all the time :) thanks Adam

Clawhammer

eric@banjohangout.org — Tue, 21 May 2013 17:25:54 CST

Do I have to up and move to America to find banjo players to learn and play with ?

Maria x

Help me leave notes out

eric@banjohangout.org — Tue, 21 May 2013 15:07:27 CST

I realize that part of the problem with studying a tab is that I learn all these accent notes that I don't need, and then my playing sounds like me struggling through a tab rather than playing a song. I'm working to change my relationship with tab (there are some things it is very helpful for, and I do a dance in and out of different learning tools depending on which part of my brain got enough coffee). Arkansas Traveler is not coming easily to me; I got bogged down in a wrong pattern of emphasis and I had to take some time to back up. In that particular song, there is a little tricky bit at the beginning of the A part where there's a little G - F# drop, and sometimes getting hung up there throws my flow off.

This got me thinking about how to learn to intuit which notes can be dropped. It seems like the goal in progressing would be to get clean, crisp notes, as few as you need to communicate the tune, and then add ornamentation as competence increases. Any thoughts or advice on this one?

Buying my first banjo strap...

eric@banjohangout.org — Tue, 21 May 2013 12:40:10 CST

I don't know anything about banjo straps, what brand to get or what size. It seems like Lakota Straps are reviewed very positively. What size would you recommend for a clawhammer/open back player?

Playing in G on an A scale banjo

eric@banjohangout.org — Tue, 21 May 2013 11:31:46 CST

Been thinking about getting a fretless mountain banjo, A scale.

With the A scale, you're really set for open A (aEAC#E), A modal (aEADE) and double D (aDADE).

What do you do when you want to play in G? It seems that the easiest thing to do, from a re-tuning standpoint, is, from A modal, to drop the 5th string from a to g and play the G tunes out of gEADE.

Is that what most folks do?

Thank you!

Traditional clawhammer?

eric@banjohangout.org — Tue, 21 May 2013 09:54:41 CST

I have noticed the term “Traditional” clawhammer cropping up in a few posts and wonder exactly what that means. I suppose the opposite must be “Modern” clawhammer. What is the difference?

Question for you other fretless players

eric@banjohangout.org — Tue, 21 May 2013 08:47:53 CST

How many of you use capos over retuning?

I've been working on improving tone when using a capo but as I research more and more, conventional wisdom seemed to imply that fretless players did not use capos, retuning the axe instead.

Thoughts?

Reading tab

eric@banjohangout.org — Tue, 21 May 2013 08:32:45 CST

I am a novice and Iinitally learnt clawhammer from Wayne Erbsens Clawhammer for the complete ignoramus (Would highly recommend this book) and have since pullled some tab from the internet and also like Kelly Griners Irish pub songs book. The problem is that their tab is different / less complicated than most clawhammer tab and I struggle to make sense of it and therefore am limited to what I can play. Any help would be appreciated..

Thanks for listening

Maria

Beginner Clawhammer

eric@banjohangout.org — Tue, 21 May 2013 07:43:59 CST

I'm seriously considering purchasing a clawhammer banjo. Could someone advise me on the best books or instruction DVD's for a beginner? Thank you in advance. Larry

Using chords while playing a tune, and strumming on the "dit"

eric@banjohangout.org — Mon, 20 May 2013 19:59:03 CST

Alright, I'm gathering my knowledge for getting on with this banjo journey and must ask, whats the deal with playing chords while playing a tune?

Now I learned shady grove clawhammer guitar from Steve Baughman's geat DVD. Tuned to double drop D, (both E strings tuned down to D), and he directs one to hold down two fingers to make a D7 chord and to hold that chord throughout the whole tune, only removing the fingers when needed. I understand that makes enough sense to do. But

quote:

Originally posted by grumpsie
to OP I would say the following:

in open G, you have G and C easily (just use an F chord and no D(7) chord for C). You also have G Mixolydian easily (just play an F chord instead of an F7th, or rather, an F note rather than an F sharp). For D I would tune 5th string to A and leave the rest of the strings (but I generally find a barred A chord to sound a bit weak compared to the full sounds you can get in open or double D, so I don't do it myself).

apart from those keys, you'd be stuck with moveable chord shapes (again, costello's stuff is good for learning this) and only be able to use the 5th string once in a blue moon.

The thing is I dont know enough to fully understand and apply this. So I ask, if learning a tune, in any tuning, how would one know IF they should be holding a chord down or not? And which one? It might be indicated in TAB, and in the case of the shady grove TAB that came with the DVD it was obviously indicated. But I might not be using TAB. I might be reading straight sheet music. Furthermore, if I was using TAB that gets me playing a tune, would I just play it how it says with no additional chords if there's none indicated?

That goes right on into the other question, bum ditty. You see I was learned to strum a chord on the "ditt" throughout most of the the tune except for certain pieces of melody. Generally. But I noticed that sometimes I may tend to not actually get much of a strum on the "ditt" but rather just play one note. And the tune sounds fine, but is that a bad habbit developing? To play most of the melody without much of a chord on the "ditt"?

Cause when I listen to tunes I can often hear that strum is hitting more than one note. I think I may have read that this is one of the differences between "claw" and "frail". It doesnt really matter to me whether I'm clawing or frailing, as long as I'm playing it legit.

Thanks for all of your advice

Galway Girl

eric@banjohangout.org — Mon, 20 May 2013 16:12:42 CST

Hello there. Does anyone have the tab for Galway Girl In open G for clawhammer? The tab on this site doesn't seem to work.

Thank you. Maria x

Hertfordshire. England

upbeat/uptempo tunes

eric@banjohangout.org — Mon, 20 May 2013 09:37:19 CST

Hi there - I've been playing Rain and Snow and Chilly Winds and now am in the mood for something a little more sunny! Looking for some suggestions for lively, upbeat tunes and songs. 'Black-eyed Suzie' springs to mind. What are your favourites?

Patrick Costello and supporters shoot themselves in the foot.

eric@banjohangout.org — Mon, 20 May 2013 01:30:01 CST

See my two replies to the posting.

http://www.banjohangout.org/topic/262832/1

Playing with others in alternative tunings

eric@banjohangout.org — Sun, 19 May 2013 23:04:08 CST

I'm basically self-taught, with a fool for a student, and I've always played banjo in open G. This wasn't so much of an issue when I was playing bluegrass style, nor is it an issue now because most of the jams I attend are of the "folk jam" variety, lots of different styles, blues, rock, country, bluegrass, etc..., barely enough time to capo up, never mind change the tuning.

So, now I'm messing around with clawhammer and exploring alternative tunings. Sawmill is cool...kind of spooky. But I'm just learning songs in sawmill tuning, no chords. Are there chords? Does one even play different keys in sawmill tuning? When I'm playing in open G, I can play in most any key, but when I'm playing in the Sawmill tuning, I don't even know what key I'm playing in...I'm just memorizing songs (or picking them out by ear). Does one play different keys in sawmill tuning?

Additionally. how does a guitar play along? Does the guitar also have to be in sawmill tuning? It's seems like if the guitar isn't also modal, you're kind of defeating the purpose.

Confused.

I can't stop strumming!!!

eric@banjohangout.org — Sun, 19 May 2013 22:55:39 CST

I've been frailing for a few months now, and I think I'm doing pretty well! Got a few tunes under my belt and I've got sent rhythm. However, my instructor challenged me to not strum for a while, and to my surprise, I can't seem to do it! I do a "bum ditty" with a strum just before I pluck the 5th string (on the "dit", lol). I'm supposed to learn to not do that, and I don't know why I'm having so much trouble doing it. I can make the strum less pronounced, but I can't seem to get rid of it altogether. What do some of you do?

Btw, I should mention that I really really like my instructor because he doesn't try to keep me from being original in my play style. I think the point of this exercise is to make my technique more deliberate so I can play either way on command. So don't think I'm complaining about him! Lol

Do you use 1 finger, 2 fingers, or all fingers in your clawhammer playing?

eric@banjohangout.org — Sun, 19 May 2013 20:07:51 CST

Hello,

I guess that should start out by saying that I am new to the forum and new to the banjo. In fact I don't even own a banjo yet! I hope to have one in the near future though (been looking at Reiter Round Peaks)!

Anyway, if my memory serves me correctly, in both Dan Levenson's and Bob Carlin's clawhammer instruction DVDs they both do the "down picking" (I might be using the wrong term!) with either the pointer or middle finger. I just watched a couple of Cathy Fink's lessons on TrueFire and I think she said to use all the fingers. So my question is what should I be doing as a beginner? Should I be trying out all three different ways (I am using one of my guitars until I get a banjo)?

Thanks much!

-Ryan

TOTW 5/17/2013 Bacon Rind

eric@banjohangout.org — Fri, 17 May 2013 15:03:53 CST

I’ve chosen a tune from Kentucky fiddler Everett Kays for this TOTW. Mr. Kays called the tune “Bacon Rind” but others might know it as “Sal’s Got a Meatskin”. The lyrics are slightly suggestive and it may be that Mr. Kays’ sensitivity to such matters led him to change the title. In the Ozark region the tune is sometimes known as “Sal’s Got a Wooden Leg”.

I had difficulty navigating the normally very reliable and informative Fiddler’s Companion and of necessity turned to other sources for a history of the tune.

According to the Folksongs of the Southern Highlands web site at Traditional Music UK the earliest reference to the song appears to be in American Negro Folk Songs, published in 1926, followed closely by a reference in American Mountain Songs in 1927. This web page also lists an Avery County, North Carolina source from 1930. John Harrod, in notes to the Kays recording above, refers to a 1934 recording by the Carlisle Brothers. The New Lost City Ramblers recorded a version in 1961.

An internet search returned three hits for Bacon Rind.

A snippet of the original Kays field recording can be found here: Kays

Hangout member Fretlessin Texas posted a stringband version of Bacon Rind here: Fretless

Clawhammer Mike posted Bacon Rind to his Clawhammer Tune of the Day blog here: Clawhammer Mike

A couple of other performances were found under the title Sal’s Got a Meatskin.

Jackie Helton and Jesse Well perform Sal’s Got a Meatskin at the 2012 Berea College Celebration of Traditional Music here: Jackie and Jesse

And a vocal rendition of Sal’s Got a Meatskin from ESTU Magic City is here: Magic City

I was unable to find a tab for Bacon Rind but the tune is simple enough in open G or A tuning that most folks should be able to pick out the melody after hearing it a time or two.

This one practically cries out for Member input so I encourage you to post your musical interpretations and tabs.

string damping

eric@banjohangout.org — Fri, 17 May 2013 11:11:45 CST

I've been playing electric guitar for many years and I'm use to damping the string near the bridge with the bottom of the palm. I've recently started playing old time banjo (bum ditty) and wondered how you banjo players damp the strings?

Cathy Fink-Clawhammer workshops June 9-14

eric@banjohangout.org — Fri, 17 May 2013 09:18:47 CST

I'm teaching clawhammer at Steve Kaufman's Acoustic Kamp near Knoxville, TN with an intentionally SMALL class of 5-8. Lots of private time and other staff members are fabulous, including Peter Ostrousko (fiddle), Marcy Marxer (uke & guitar) and a great guitar staff. I am also offering 1 FREE Truefire Clawhammer module (200 minutes of instruction) of any level to each person who takes the class. 2 hours instruction each morning on old time banjo and a wide range of classes in the afternoon.

Registration: http://www.flatpik.com/Steve-Kaufman-Acoustic-Kamp

Questions? -info@cathymarcy.com

If you go to youtube and search Cathy Fink Clawhammer Truefire, you'll see lots of free videos from the Truefire course.

It's a fun camp all round, lots of jamming and good, friendly folks.

Cathy

Thumb hiting the head

eric@banjohangout.org — Fri, 17 May 2013 08:31:58 CST

Hi there, I've been learning the banjo for just over a year now. I started out with ken pearlmans melodic style wich is great and his books are great but have recently switched to more of a round peak style usings tabs from Mary z cox witch I find much more fun to play , although when playing this way I make a lot of sound with my thumb hiting the head I actually like the sound it makes . i find it gives it a bit of beat but not sure others will appreciate it, is this sound common or should I try work it out of my playing, thanks for your time, Richard.

EDIT....Here's me playing a song called last chance on YouTube you might get a better idea of what I mean

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RPSaspI34c&feature=youtu.be

How do I play different key tunes when tuned to open G

eric@banjohangout.org — Thu, 16 May 2013 19:38:13 CST

Hello,

I am very new to banjo but am quite familiar with fiddle, and transposing tunes to my preferred keys is something I do on the fiddle.

It's quite simple, just moving the tune up or down the staff (of sheet music) as needed. As a tune in Em may start on an E, I use that as an anchor note to place on the new desired key note, like moving the whole tune up three notes to Am. Basically.

So Im gettin on the clawhammer banjo now for a month or two and I want to just find tunes from wherever, (like some fiddle tunes), and transpose it to G, making the Key note the G-string. I have done this now for a couple tunes and it works pretty good.

But, I have noticed that other key tunes are played while in open G tuning. With no capo? So how would I transpose a tune into another key while still in open G? (And what are the best keys?) I'm guessing here but, do the other keys that can be used need to "harmonize" with G?

Such as D, or Bm, or Em...? And if so, would I just set the base note of the tune on the desired new key note (on the fingerboard) and transpose it from there? Then get on and play it, and work it into a set of other such tunes that all are played in open G tuning, playing in different keys, all the while the open tuning ringing out nicely?

So if you can help me here that would be awesome. Thanks

Clawhammer index question

eric@banjohangout.org — Thu, 16 May 2013 07:06:24 CST

Hey,

I have played scruggs style for about seven months and am just now discovering and loving clawhammer style. My question is that i am far more comfortable using my middle for hitting melody notes and brushes and i tend to just get my index slightly out out the way. It is still curved most of the time but I kind of just raise it a bit. Is this wrong? It seems to make it easier when i attempt to drop my thumb and seems more accurate when its out of the way. I just dont want to get into a bad habit i cant break. I hope this isnt incorrect. Thanks for the help.

best slow (sad?) clawhammer songs or players?

eric@banjohangout.org — Thu, 16 May 2013 06:58:32 CST

Hi,

I'm now fully on board with the hypnotic effects of playing fast (well, in my case, medium). But I went into this, in part, because of slow, celtic-ish, backup playing on songs that I liked: Eric Bogle, Fred Kelly ("Leaving of Liverpool"), the Wailing Jennys "Glory Bound" etc. I wasn't originally all that clear of the different styles of banjo playing (rolls vs clawhammer), but now I'm more interested. Plus, after practicing the fast (medium) stuff, it's fun to sit back and play slow mournful sounds, as long as nobody else is listening.

So, any favorites?

Will

Why does everyone use Double C tuning instead of Open D?

eric@banjohangout.org — Thu, 16 May 2013 06:51:43 CST

I'm new to clawhammer banjo, though I've played guitar and mandolin for many years. I'm enjoying learning a bunch of tunes in double-C tuning, but it does seem to be a rather quirky tuning, what with the 1st and 2nd strings tuned only a whole step apart.

It seems surprising to me that an Open-D tuning like aDF#AD isn't used instead. What do you guys think the reason is that Open D isn't standard for playing tunes in D? Is it just due to tradition? Do any of you use Open D?

Old Time Jams in Minnesota

eric@banjohangout.org — Wed, 15 May 2013 21:34:54 CST

I'm still a beginner and I've never been to a jam but I'd really REALLY like to go. If anyone knows of any upcoming in the Twin Cities/surrounding area I'd be grateful!

5th string POP sound

eric@banjohangout.org — Wed, 15 May 2013 15:13:36 CST

I've always liked the POP sound that some banjo players get from their 5th string. Yesterday I was giving a basic banjo lesson to a guy whose banjo just didn't have any Life in it.. Soooooooo, I put a one inch piece of cellophane tape, folded, on the 5th string just in front of the bridge, and WALAA ! That Old Time POP was sounding great on his banjo. Have any of you tried that? It is terribly simple to remove if you don't like it but it is ceratinly worth the effort to experiment.. LEE

Oldtimejam.com thread resurrection

eric@banjohangout.org — Wed, 15 May 2013 07:14:34 CST

The previous old time jam thread is now trapped in the archives, so I'm starting up a new one! I'll use this space from time to time for announcements, among other things.

The latest news is that the clawhammer tabs for volume 2 are now available for lifetime members. If you're a lifetime member and did not receive a link to the download, please contact me through the site and let me know.

That's all for now!

Josh

oldtimejam.com

When Do You Know A Tune?

eric@banjohangout.org — Tue, 14 May 2013 10:21:28 CST

Corollary to my crisis thread, I have been pondering a deeper and more ephemeral question - what is it to *know* a song? This isn't a how-to type of question, it's a philosophical one. So left-brain it out for me - what does it mean to know a tune?

Playing the same note in clawhammer?

eric@banjohangout.org — Mon, 13 May 2013 23:27:32 CST

Is there a technique for playing a series of the same note in clawhammer style? An example would be 8th notes D D D D E E F F all on the 4th string. i thought I might just do drop thumb on the same string but found that did not work.

Dan Levenson will teach old-time banjo at Rolland Fiddle Camp June 23-29

eric@banjohangout.org — Mon, 13 May 2013 22:11:26 CST

Rolland Fiddle Camp (www.peterrolland.com) is delighted that Dan Levenson (www.clawdan.com) will again join the faculty at the week-long camp (June 23-29) in Colorado. Many of you probably already know Dan as the author of numerous banjo and fiddle books for Mel Bay Books, and as the claw-hammer banjo player in the The Boiled Buzzards. Dan is a great banjo & fiddle teacher and jam leader, and we are honored to have him back on our teaching staff. Our camp is in a beautiful secluded spot, ideal for total immersion into the study of old-time music. The small camp setting makes for great camaraderie among participants and insures small group classes and lots of 1-on-1 interaction with the teachers. It's a great way to improve your skills, straighten out your technique and learn tunes. Full details about the camp and the teachers are at the camp pages within my website www.peterrolland.com. Anyone with questions or commentary can contact me at peterrolland@cox.net, at 480-969-9744 (home) or 602-618-6285 (cell) after June 7, or at www.peterrolland.com.

Best wishes to all,

Peter Rolland, camp director; peterrolland@cox.net; 480-969-9744; www.peterrolland.com

Stroke style banjo

eric@banjohangout.org — Mon, 13 May 2013 09:04:58 CST

I just watched a video demo of "how to play stroke style banjo". From what I understood, the index finger always hits just the first string, and the thumb is used on the other 3 strings --- similar to drop and double thumbing. I guess that would meant the "bum", or down stroke with the index finger is just used as a drone, and used only on the first string. Is that correct?

a different way of playing, at least to me

eric@banjohangout.org — Sat, 11 May 2013 11:08:08 CST

I wish you'd listen to the link below, and give me your thoughts. This is an idea that just jumped out at me, probably motivated by my liking for old time music I heard when I was a boy -- simple people just sitting around playing simple, no frills, music. This, I played with just the thumb ( can't get much simpler than that, I guess, unless I just blow on the strings or something ). Please keep in mind that this is completely un-practiced and un-polished, it's just an idea that sprung up. I'd like your opinion, I think it has possibilities for some kinds of music. Be gentle, please, I've had heart surgery and I have COPD ( and an excellent lawyer -- just kidding, of course ). Thanks for your help.

Wisdom of a 2nd Banjo

eric@banjohangout.org — Fri, 10 May 2013 14:06:36 CST

Howdy,

I play fretless and have a great banjo...a Ramsey custom set up just the way I like.

However, I have just come into a little bit of money, enough to easily afford a 2nd banjo....and I'm trying to decide the wisdom of the acquisition (another fretless, thank you)..

Pluses: avoid having the hassle of retuning when tuning out of G or A; easier to make sound good by tuning to alternate tuning; having a 2nd banjo to take to festivals, where if damage or stolen, I'm not completely devastated; buying that really cool Chuck Lee I saw; feeds instrument acquisition syndrome

Minuses; not saving money, allows me to take a short cut alleviating the need to tune (after all, how many banjos did Doc, Fred, Wade or Kyle have? Avoids instrument acquisition syndrome.

What do you all think?

I think I'm just venting? Need encouragement

eric@banjohangout.org — Fri, 10 May 2013 11:21:57 CST

I am feeling so very frustrated with my banjo playing. You guys are all so helpful, and I am working SO hard. I practice quite a bit, sometimes even a few hours a day (which is a lot for a stay-at-home mom of two young children), I think and I listen listen listen and I ask LOTS of questions. I am learning to play by ear, I can read standard notation and tab, I have had a couple lessons with different excellent players, I tape myself and watch the tapes, etc.

MY PLAYING SOUNDS TERRIBLE! It just feels so stuck, like I can't progress. Or, I make lots of progress but I never get good. I have maybe a dozen tunes that I play from memory, and I am still struggling on every.single.one. Nothing plays in my sleep, unless I have been playing the same tune for a few hours and then sometimes I'm almost there (unless I try to tape it). I keep trying to make some videos to post to my page so that I can demonstrate my progress from the tape I made when I was just starting and ask for advice, but I cannot get through a single song while the camera is rolling without making a million mistakes, tone or no tone. If I play fast enough to make it sound like a song, I'm lucky to hit half the notes! I'm so terribly discouraged.

Wound 3rd?

eric@banjohangout.org — Fri, 10 May 2013 07:13:19 CST

Just getting back to claw hammer after a 40 year break. I have been playing Irish tenor for the past 10 years or so. When I first got into Irish tenor the standard irish set had two wound and two plain strings. I discovered most of the better players were using 3 wound and 1 plain string, for a fuller and more balanced sound. Over the years i have developed my own preferences and make up my own sets of phospher bronze.

I have been researching CH strings and gauges and have been wondering if anyone uses a wound 2nd? I may order some .016w and .017w. Currently my lightest is.018 which would be a bit too heavy.

Thanks!

Bob.

TOTW 05/10/13, Tommy Jarrell's Sail Away Ladies

eric@banjohangout.org — Thu, 9 May 2013 21:17:20 CST

Are there any Tommy Jarrell fans out there? I know I am one. Both his fiddling and his banjo playing are fantastic. It took a while, but I actually enjoy his singing too! On the CD "The Legacy of Tommy Jarrell Volume 1, Sail Away Ladies", he describes how he learned the tune from old man Pet McKinney who was a Confederate veteran. My wife gets a real kick out of the story because Pet plucks the strings of his fiddle to show Tommy the tuning, (standard tuning), and Tommy remarks how he has never heard a fiddle tuned like that before. I believe Pet was actually William Preston McKinney. I could not find any recordings of him, but I believe I have found a picture of his grave...

http://www.cemeterycensus.net/nc/surr/cempic.htm?cem=391&pic=391-004.jpg

Anyway, this is a great tune and it is not to be confused with the other version of Sail Away Ladies done as the TOTW on 11/05/10. It's pretty easy the way I play it on the banjo. It's all G and E minor.

I am also a big fan of John Herrmann's banjo playing. He recently released an album with John Engle and Meredith McIntosh called Chicken Train. John Engle, if you are not familiar with him has studied Tommy's fiddling intensely and sounds amazingly similar. I recommend this CD which has a great version of this tune.

Link to Chicken Train CD:

http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/herrmannengleandmcintnos

I thought this CD was out of print, but it is apparently back in. Jimmy Johnny Joe is a great CD featuring Joe Thrift and Mark Olitzky. They have a great version of the tune as well.

Link to Jimmy Johnny Joe:

http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/jimmyjohnnyjoe

Of course, nothing is as good as the original!

Link to Tommy Jarrell CD:

http://www.amazon.com/The-Legacy-Tommy-Jarrell-Vol/dp/B00000J29N

I guess if you have listened to all of the opening acts, you can move on to my wife and I doing this tune in our living room. Hope you learn this tune!

Sandy River Belle question

eric@banjohangout.org — Thu, 9 May 2013 14:26:15 CST

(Can you tell I'm trying to get the lead out before a jam this weekend:) There is a TOTW of Sandy River, but it doesn't seem to be quite the same as the Sandy River Belle that I hear on the hangout. Sandy River Belle is in G, but it seems like the traditional tuning for it is F capoed up, yes? (The "Sandy River Belle" tuning) I tried practicing it in both tunings today, and I get confused, so I think I need to choose one until I really have it and then I can mix it up. It seems to sound a little prettier in the F tuning, but I'm wondering if it makes more sense to learn it in the G tuning since, in a jam setting, we aren't likely to tune to F since there aren't as many songs in that tuning?

Thoughts?

John Brown's Dream

eric@banjohangout.org — Thu, 9 May 2013 09:37:58 CST

I deleted my last post because it wasn't accurate, but I still see a discrepancy between the recorded versions and the printed versions of this song, or else I'm making a mistake. It doesn't appear to have been TOTW yet. When I play the B part, it's something like 3x D#/ED#C# then EC#BA (with some slurs in there). The Fiddler's Fakebook has that B part going up to F#. Am I making up that D# (which I know isn't in the A major scale), and do you usually play that high F#?

Clawhammer Help

eric@banjohangout.org — Thu, 9 May 2013 08:42:55 CST

I have tried and tried to learn this style of banjo playing, love the music but cannot seem to play it any suggestions?

Banjo for frailing/clawhammer - long or standard neck? Cleaning questions?

eric@banjohangout.org — Wed, 8 May 2013 16:40:18 CST

Hi everyone, I'm new here and new to the banjo. I want to play clawhammer style and I acquired a a five string, long neck, arch top, open back banjo, but then I got to wondering and reading and now I don't know if a long neck is what I should have got. I read that long necks became popular in the 60's with folk music, but since I want to play more old time, I'm wondering if a standard neck banjo would have been more in keeping with the older era music I want to play? I'm know I can capo the long neck, but are there any drawbacks to using the long neck for flailing?

I really like everything about the banjo I've got. It's a custom made instrument, and it really feels nice in my hands. I'm a guitar and bass player for many years so I know what I like in the way an instrument feels. I'll be posting pictures to try to identify the banjo as soon as I get it cleaned up which raises another question. The neck and body are made of some mystery wood that right now looks dry but not cracked. It's a medium brown color. I intend to take the instrument apart to clean all parts. I'm thinking of using a quality oil on the wood, maybe something like Watco, but is there a type of oil recommended for this use? And then followed with polish?

I know pictures would help, and they will be coming. The only information on the instrument is the makers signature on the inside of the body "John Eide No 5"

Thanks all for help with this.

Question Regarding Scales

eric@banjohangout.org — Wed, 8 May 2013 08:55:09 CST

Hello everyone! I'm new to the the forum and really new to the banjo. I bought myself a Deering "Good Time" and am learning from Wayne Erbsen's book "Clawhammer Banjo for the Complete Ignoramus". Now, when doing scales, I'm not sure which fingers to start with. For example, the C scale starts with an open fourth string and is then fingered at the second fret. I intstinctively place my index finger there, but logic tells me to use my middle finger instead. I'm assuming that one should designate the first fret to the index finger, 2nd middle, 3rd ring, 4th pinky and continue up the neck in that order. Can anyone shed a little light on this please?

Swananoa Gathering Class Decision help

eric@banjohangout.org — Mon, 6 May 2013 17:10:10 CST

Hey guys,

I plan to attend Old Time week for the first time this year. This will also be my first "camp" experience.

I consider myself an upper intermediate player, I've been playing for 3+ years, I'm comfortable jamming/improvising, and performing in front of people (I'm in an "old time" duo)

I'm already signed up for my classes but I'm rethinking my decisions. The way I look at it is I'd rather be "pushed" and take the more advanced classed , than be bored in the mid-level classes.

One skill I'd really like to really hone in on, is instruction and technique on how to play better with a fiddle player, I can hold my own. But i feel I am still lacking in this department.

I've decided I will forsure take a level III class with John Herrmann:

OLD-TIME BANJO III B (John Herrmann)
This class for intermediate/advanced banjo players will focus on playing banjo with a fiddle. Emphasis will be placed on the rhythmic connection between the two, the relationship of melody to chords/drones, and the tight interplay between these two instruments, which are the core of the old-time band. This is not a tune-oriented class. We will mainly cover technique and theory and there will be tips on how to play tunes you don’t already know.

I'm kinda on the fence about the second:

its between a class by Tom Sauber or Joseph Decosimo:

OLD-TIME BANJO III A (Tom Sauber)
This class for intermediate/advanced players will start with a recap of the Round Peak style of clawhammer banjo. Using the common tunings for the keys of A and D we’ll review the left- and right-hand licks that are used so effectively to play the melody, while at the same time providing a driving rhythm to support the fiddle. From there, we’ll venture outward from the Blue Ridge, applying the Round Peak approach to tunes from other regions and repertoires such as Kentucky, West Virginia, Mississippi, and the mid-west. We’ll also explore several alternate tunings, which work quite well for tunes in the keys of G and C, and which are under-represented in the Round Peak repertoire, but quite common

OLD-TIME BANJO II A (Joseph Decosimo)
In this class, we will work on intermediate old-time banjo repertoire and techniques that will be useful for solo playing, playing with a fiddle, and playing with stringbands. We will pay close attention to the right hand as the engine that drives clawhammer banjo. By rooting ourselves in some delightful tunes that utilize several tunings and techniques, we’ll work on developing our ear, our ability to flesh out tunes, and our sense of where the banjo fits in when playing with others. Ultimately, we’ll work towards being better listeners and more confident players, capable of learning and working tunes into our own repertoires. If time and interest permit, we may spend a day discussing the rudiments of some old-time up-picking styles. Plan to have fun

I'm currently signed up for the Tom Sauber class, but I'm considering switching to Joseph Decosimo's class. One of my concerns is that this is a 9am class. I intended to be up late jamming. On one hand it seems light, fun, and a good warm up for my more advanced class later on in the day. On the other hand, I dont want to be stuck in a class that's too slow. I supposed it is always good to review the basics, from a fresh perspective.

On the other side of the argument, Tom Sauber is alot more "famous" i guess you can say, and is not a regular teacher at Swananoa, I feel like I should jump on the opportunity to take a class with him. I'm not a round-peak player, but I love the style, and I do dabble in it, and incorporate round peak licks into my own playing. It would be worth it for me to explore further.

Sorry for the long thread. Please feel free to give your suggestions. And if you are also going to Swananoa or have been in the past let me know how you liked it.

I'm pretty excited for the summer. And I am thinking of heading to Clifftop right after. Thanks!

Favorite tunes in odd tunings

eric@banjohangout.org — Mon, 6 May 2013 16:06:30 CST

I need more reasons to switch to 'little birdie'(eCGCC) tuning and open D tuning(f#DF#AD). And sorry if these are not the correct names for these tunings, kinda new at this.

At the moment, I only play little birdie and darlin' cora in eCGCC, and reuben's train and redemption song (yes, a bob marley cover) in open D. I really like to play darlin cora and reuben's train.

So, what are some tunes ya'll like to play in these tunings???