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Please note this is an archived topic, so it is locked and unable to be replied to. You may, however, start a new topic and refer to this topic with a link.
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Wykowski - Posted - 12/12/2006: 16:48:15
Bring me your Cynics,
Your Comedians,
Your Jerks who are yearning to be FREE !!!
It seems like every time people speak their TRUE-Feelings the thread gets shut down, which shuts people out of the fun.
I know that's the rules, so don't respond with any rules quotes
Let's have a 'free-for-all' section, and throw out the rules (in that section only) and have some FUN !!!
(I know this will never happen, but a guy can dream)
Thank You 
Edited by - Wykowski on 12/12/2006 17:06:49
garyblanchard - Posted - 12/12/2006: 17:03:01
I understand that there are some forums out there that are just what you describe. You can also begin your own forum; there are several companies that offer free forum software.
If the Hangout ever goes to that format, however, I will relinquish my moderatorship. That isn't the type of place I would want to spend my time. Generally, the hard feelings in the free-for-all section get carried into other areas of the forum. That happened here in the days when R&P topics were allowed, and it wasn't pretty.
Gary Blanchard
Preserving the Old-Time/Good-Time Tradition
http://www.brookfieldsmusic.net
Wykowski - Posted - 12/12/2006: 17:20:48
Lighten Up, Gary
(comment removed)
oldbanjoman - Posted - 12/12/2006: 17:25:53
quote:
Originally posted by garyblanchard
...If the Hangout ever goes to that format, however, I will relinquish my moderatorship. That isn't the type of place I would want to spend my time. Generally, the hard feelings in the free-for-all section get carried into other areas of the forum. That happened here in the days when R&P topics were allowed, and it wasn't pretty.
Gary Blanchard
I'm with you, Gary. If the BHO ever de-evolved to that level, I'd quit, too! Dean L. * '82 Stelling Whitestar * '81 Stelling Bellflower * Home-built, short-scale travel banjo
garyblanchard - Posted - 12/12/2006: 17:29:14
quote:
Originally posted by Wykowski
Lighten Up, Gary
(comment removed)
Sorry, but after the last couple of days here I am to fried to lighten up.  I'll try not to step on your fun, though. Gary Blanchard Preserving the Old-Time/Good-Time Tradition http://www.brookfieldsmusic.net
Wykowski - Posted - 12/12/2006: 18:02:31
quote:
Originally posted by garyblanchard
quote:
Originally posted by Wykowski
Lighten Up, Gary
(comment removed)
Sorry, but after the last couple of days here I am to fried to lighten up.
I'll try not to step on your fun, though.
Gary Blanchard
Preserving the Old-Time/Good-Time Tradition
http://www.brookfieldsmusic.net
sorry, to ruffle any feathers, but all the recent locked threads was why I posted in the 1st place, I guess I just find conflict to be interesting, and I was sort of just trying to make light of "the last couple of days here"
gottasmilealot - Posted - 12/12/2006: 20:53:33
quote:
Let's have a 'free-for-all' section, and throw out the rules (in that section only) and have some FUN !!!
We did that once with a Religion and Politics Topic Area, now we know better. Bluegrass Rules has an unmoderated section at http://www.bluegrassrules.com/forum...?FORUM_ID=14Keith
banzar - Posted - 12/13/2006: 00:56:06
Personally I like to see how close some folks get to the "edge" of these rules before they are locked.....makes for exciting reading and it keeps me awake at work.
Sometime I think they get locked before the fun starts but.....oh just as well.
One the other hand, I think that there is no objectivity in moderation or censorship for that matter....folks just need to be responsible and think before they post.
I would also like to add...WHY is is that quoting the Bible in the Taglines of some BHO members NOT considered religious and a violation of the rules? or does this just apply to the Topics?
RODNEYJOHNSON - Posted - 12/13/2006: 09:01:26
I love good clean conflict.Is that an oxymoron?This sites main draw is that is is CLEAN enough to let your wife,your kids,or your preacher read over your shoulder without any embarassment to yourself.
HOTROD<")))><
Soop - Posted - 12/13/2006: 10:32:59
Finally! I wrote this several weeks ago, following a bout of locked-thread-itis. I've not posted it because... well, there just wasn't relevant thread, and I didn't want to start its own thread. I'm not throwing my hat in with Wykowski because truly there are many other forums available for that kind of thing. Here goes nothing:
The way this forum is structured, I know exactly which section I'm interested in. (whoops. ended with preposition. ) For example, I don't frail, so I'm not really interested in the Clawhammer section.
I'm relatively new to this site, but I spent several years on a political forum where, obviously, politics and religion were discussed incessantly. When that forum became all-consuming, I decided to ditch it and move on with my life. There are far more important things in my life than trying to convince someone I'm right and he's wrong.
I gingerly stepped into the BHO because I figured it was pretty safe. How many arguments can there be over banjos? Frailing vs. 3-finger? Who's better - Bela or Earl? Come on. Seemed pretty tame.
I admit the old habits got the better of me in the disappearing seafood thread. Generally when someone posts an interesting article it is to generate discussion, and discussion it did generate. While I was surprised to see this topic in a banjo forum, it was in Off-Topic, and while opinions were expressed, I think they were generally respectful, if memory serves. And it obviously went into politics. Where else would it go?
Then someone posted their thoughts - not an article for discussion, but their own opinion - that the planet would be better off if 5,994,000,000 people dropped dead. Well, of course that's going to generate discussion, and heated discussion at that. One can't see an opening comment like that going anywhere but downhill. Fast. Should have been deleted at the beginning.
The Universe thread couldn't go anywhere but into religion. To keep half the debate silenced is not only unfair but intellectually dishonest. This is not an indictment of the BHO; one must respect and work within the rules. What I'm saying is this was another thread that should have been stopped in its infancy because there was one and only one path it could realistically follow.
I guess what I’m getting at, and really it’s an open question to the moderators of this site – the rules are pretty self-explanatory. And that’s fine. We’re all guests of Eric’s site. And as guests we abide by the rules of the house. As it should be. There are plenty of other forums to discuss all of the above topics. Shouldn’t threads that clearly are going to devolve into religious or heated debates be stopped before they grow legs? Each of the above threads I cited clearly could have no other outcome than to get into politics or religion – topics expressly forbidden here. The Homosexual thread, started by a member expressing his opinion based on limited experience, was deleted very shortly after it started, so I know it can be done.
Sorry about being so verbose. I’m just curious more than anything as to why certain threads are started at all, when clearly the end result will be a locked topic. And I’m not picking on any one member or singling anyone out. The examples I cited are just that - examples. Not indictments on anyone.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents."
-- James Madison, 4 Annals of congress 179 (1794)
garyblanchard - Posted - 12/13/2006: 11:19:49
quote:
Originally posted by Soop
Sorry about being so verbose. I’m just curious more than anything as to why certain threads are started at all, when clearly the end result will be a locked topic. And I’m not picking on any one member or singling anyone out. The examples I cited are just that - examples. Not indictments on anyone.
I think some folks truly believe that the discussion will not stray into religion or politics and post in that mindset. There may be some who want to push the envelope; there may even be a few who want to stir things up a bit. As a moderator, unless the topic is obviously forbidden, I tend to put trust in people's ability to keep things civil and within the rules and guidelines. Posting warnings is my next step, and locking comes only as a last resort. All in all, we have a great bunch of folks here. With so many people there will be divergent opinions and interpretations of what is acceptable; the folks here handle all that pretty well. When you consider the number of posts here every day, we have very little trouble. Some very good thoughts and observations, Soop. Thanks. Gary Blanchard Preserving the Old-Time/Good-Time Tradition http://www.brookfieldsmusic.net
Unplugged - Posted - 12/13/2006: 12:34:48
quote:
Originally posted by Soop
I’m just curious more than anything as to why certain threads are started at all, when clearly the end result will be a locked topic.
Some good points, Soop. Despite the rules, there are always going to be people who want to push the limits - whether seriously or (as in Wyk's whimsical way) in jest - just to see what they can get away with. Some think that they are putting it to "The Man", when they are just being pains in the derrierre to the regular people who are merely "on-duty", like some of the ten-year old kids that I teach (I love 'em all, but some make me work more than is fair). For kids to do it, I can understand that that's how they explore boundaries of their world. For adults doing it jest fer fun, well, it's still just as exhausting for those on-duty to have to keep reminding about the limits of a private site. Steve Love to pick. Love to sing. Let's jam!
Banjoman - Posted - 12/13/2006: 14:35:07
quote:
Originally posted by banzar
I would also like to add...WHY is is that quoting the Bible in the Taglines of some BHO members NOT considered religious and a violation of the rules? or does this just apply to the Topics?
Here's the rule: Political and religious topics are prohibited. We've already tried allowing these and decided against it. Non-argumentative religious topics will be allowed at the moderators' discretion (ie, a "Please pray for so and so" topic is fine.) Religious and political debate are not allowed. Tag lines are not topics and are not argumentative. So, a Bible verse or a little something for a signature is fine. As long as it not there to incite trouble. Politics are not allowed at all. So, if you have a political signature you may be asked to remove it. Hugh Playing since 1964 "If the banjo was any good, The Beatles would have used it."- Bill McEuen Click Here: Banjo Hangout Rules & Guidelines.Click Here: Bobby Thompson's Home Page
Edited by - Banjoman on 12/13/2006 14:41:26
banzar - Posted - 12/14/2006: 11:15:54
"Tag lines are not topics and are not argumentative. So, a Bible verse or a little something for a signature is fine. As long as it not there to incite trouble. Politics are not allowed at all. So, if you have a political signature you may be asked to remove it."
Why is little Bible verse okay but as you say..."Politics are not allowed at all?"......that exception bothers me.
Shouldn't The Rule be inforced 100% and be a policy against both religious and political taglines?
Just a thought.
Banjoman - Posted - 12/14/2006: 14:07:09
No, there's a big difference and this rule comes from the fact that we once had a “Religious & Political” forum. We removed all the politics and keep non-argumentative religious topics like “Please pray for Joe” permissible.
Pulse you have to remember this, BHO is privately owned and what ever the owner says goes. If the owner so chooses, he could make a rule that the membership NOT use the word "Banjo." Fair or not, and I think they are, those are the rules and you excepted them when you joined.
Hugh
Playing since 1964
"If the banjo was any good, The Beatles would have used it."- Bill McEuen
Click Here: Banjo Hangout Rules & Guidelines.
Click Here: Bobby Thompson's Home Page
Edited by - Banjoman on 12/14/2006 14:21:27
banzar - Posted - 12/14/2006: 15:05:04
I am not trying to be argumentative in these posts or pick a fight whatsoever....
Actually I am more of pacifist.
I was just putting a voice to an idea…not an original idea...nor am I trying to organize the legions to make an amendment to the rules or even criticize anyone’s’ taglines per se.
I don’t know if I had a BHO account during the “good ole day” of the “Religion and Politics” forum but I bet it was a nasty place to be…I could only imagine.
I didn’t know that just asking some questions (an not being overtly political at that) would be seen as a voice of decent or protest against you specifically or any other Moderator.
I am not questioning your observation of the rules or what you do on this site.
No intellectual "feelings" hurt here and hopefully I have not rustled your feathers Banjoman.
I have read your post and have enjoyed your comments in other topics....I was just hoping am more in-depth conversation instead of “these are the rules…abide or be banned”.
The BHO is a fantastic corner of the WWW and I do enjoy my time here and reading the conversations for time to time.... although I don’t post often.
With that said...I would contest to the existence of a thing as "non-argumentative religious topics"....
But I think we should just let this end....
I’d rather not get myself or anyone else into that heap of trouble.
Let’s leave this sleeping dog.
wrentree - Posted - 12/14/2006: 21:07:12
I am new on here and I don't want to step into quicksand. I don't need any more hassle in my life. I know I have some prejudices and might not like some parts of other guests character or personalities, but I do like the banjo and the idea that I can come on here and get other guest's opinions. If I have any differences with any of you I won't be able to put them in front of getting everything I can out of this site. Keep on Picking and talking about it.
RODNEYJOHNSON - Posted - 12/15/2006: 08:21:11
Welcome aboard Harold!
HOTROD<")))><
Thor - Posted - 12/15/2006: 14:24:22
quote:
I don’t know if I had a BHO account during the “good ole day” of the “Religion and Politics” forum but I bet it was a nasty place to be…
Nope... it was great fun. Quite hilarious at times, in fact.
ole blackie - Posted - 12/15/2006: 14:27:23
Banjoman, Im so glad you are a moderator. You do a fantastic job! You are always so calm, cool, and collected. I have a biblical signature. I am a Christian. I want my signature to be spiritual food for thought. I never thought in my wildest dreams that it might offend someone. On the other hand, the Bible tells us that "the righteous are bold as a lion". Im curious, how many biblical sigs are there out there?
Wil
..."The Lord opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble". I Peter 5:5
RODNEYJOHNSON - Posted - 12/18/2006: 11:53:53
See mine?
HOTROD<")))><
ole blackie - Posted - 12/18/2006: 12:34:37
Rod...I dont get it...but then Im slow!
Wil
..."The Lord opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble". I Peter 5:5
ole blackie - Posted - 12/18/2006: 12:36:30
Banjoman, BTW, are you gonna be the first to crank 10,000 posts?
Wil
..."The Lord opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble". I Peter 5:5
Soop - Posted - 12/18/2006: 12:38:32
quote:
Originally posted by ole blackie
Rod...I dont get it...but then Im slow!
Wil
..."The Lord opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble". I Peter 5:5
I didn't either until this thread - it's a fish! Very cool, very clever. <")))>< ---------------------------------------------------------------------- "I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents." -- James Madison, 4 Annals of congress 179 (1794)
RODNEYJOHNSON - Posted - 12/18/2006: 12:44:48
Hugh is closing in on 10000 post like a penny waitng on change!
Then he is going to hit restart,I'll bet.
HOTROD<")))><
ole blackie - Posted - 12/18/2006: 13:23:30
Ohhhhh...now I see it! Duh! Thats cool!
Wil
..."The Lord opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble". I Peter 5:5
Banjoman - Posted - 12/18/2006: 13:44:25
The count is really misleading, that's not how many times I've posted. I get tagged each time I perform a modertors duty.
Hugh
Playing since 1964
"If the banjo was any good, The Beatles would have used it."- Bill McEuen
Click Here: Banjo Hangout Rules & Guidelines.
Click Here: Bobby Thompson's Home Page
RODNEYJOHNSON - Posted - 12/18/2006: 13:48:37
Well in that case,they should give you 3 hits for each duty you perform.That's pretty cheap wages!
HOTROD<")))><
Edited by - RODNEYJOHNSON on 12/21/2006 14:42:23
Unplugged - Posted - 12/18/2006: 15:45:12
quote:
Originally posted by Banjoman
I get tagged each time I perform a modertors duty.
And so do some of us.  Steve Love to pick. Love to sing. Let's jam!
ajbadger - Posted - 12/18/2006: 21:16:22
I think one of the reasons the P&R were removed was that people came here simply to argue or start verbal fights, none of which had anything to do with banjo. In fact, many of the posts were to cause a type of disharmony between members who might have played better together had the discussion been only on some aspect of the banjo which they both enjoyed.
Although I enjoyed the passion and ideas that many of those political and relgious discussion/confrontations generated, I think the decision to keep the BHO as banjo focused as possible was probably a good one.
Members are being more civil to one another and getting more from their banjos.
Sincerely,
AJ
http://phritzysworld.wordpress.com
===============
"Reason is the slave of desire."
Unplugged - Posted - 12/18/2006: 22:18:17
Yup. I've learned to NEVER talk politics at a bluegrass jam. Would be the kiss of death. Just focus on what we all have in common. 
Steve
Love to pick. Love to sing. Let's jam!
Andy McC - Posted - 12/21/2006: 10:05:10
I find it so much easier not to talk politics, and I was a politician until a few years ago, than many do with their religeous beliefs.
Andy
"And it is in his own image, let us remember, that Man creates God."
bhmember - Posted - 02/02/2007: 01:07:32
I think it's wise to limit the discussion to non-religious/politial matters, simply because people feel so strongly about those things they can't help but get all riled up about them. Keeping the peace is more important, and if we want to evangelize or change somebody's mind about things we can make ourselves available for personal email correspondence. I don't think the owner would object to that.
It's true, there are a lot of other Forums on the Net where we can get involved in debates and satisfy that innate human need to scream and holler and beat people up. That's important in life.
But I think of this Forum as a place to escape all those serious matters for a little while and just enjoy the peace that passeth all understanding, if you know what I mean. Anyhow, the boss is the boss is the boss and I think he's protecting us from ourselves with these rules.
wannabe
"Most people are bothered by those passages of Scripture they do not understand, but the passages that bother me are those I do understand." Mark Twain
Breakdown - Posted - 02/02/2007: 09:08:24
quote:
Originally posted by bhmember
I think it's wise to limit the discussion to non-religious/politial matters, simply because people feel so strongly about those things they can't help but get all riled up about them. Keeping the peace is more important, and if we want to evangelize or change somebody's mind about things we can make ourselves available for personal email correspondence. I don't think the owner would object to that.
It's true, there are a lot of other Forums on the Net where we can get involved in debates and satisfy that innate human need to scream and holler and beat people up. That's important in life.
But I think of this Forum as a place to escape all those serious matters for a little while and just enjoy the peace that passeth all understanding, if you know what I mean. Anyhow, the boss is the boss is the boss and I think he's protecting us from ourselves with these rules.
wannabe
"Most people are bothered by those passages of Scripture they do not understand, but the passages that bother me are those I do understand." Mark Twain
I agree. And as for religious signature blocks, they tend to be positive. I haven't seen any designed to stir up argument, and I'm sure the mods would shut it down fast. I'd feel just as happy, seeing a "Blessed Be" or "An Ye Harm None, Do What Ye Will" sigblock (common to Wicca), or any other positive message, as a "Make a JOYFUL noise!" or other expressions of my own faith. As long as they're positive, and not designed to stir up argument. I enjoy the signature blocks as a tiny reflection of the poster's personality - one that's hard to convey in a text environment. Thanks, mods, for keeping us (mostly) honest! ~ Rosanne Fender FB-55 (up for adoption :-) Goodtime Openback Deering Golden Era! Myspace: grassrose
bindle stiff jim - Posted - 02/02/2007: 12:10:46
and if you faith leads you to being agnostic or to worship satan or some other belief? look at how much trash surfaces just because some people don't like the deerings faith. how many people would be offended by a tag line that said something like "follow the teachings of satan, the true savior of mankind"? there are people that truely feel that way.
dave - banjo pickin' backpacker
midlothian, va
Edited by - bindle stiff jim on 02/02/2007 12:11:32
bhmember - Posted - 02/02/2007: 13:33:05
Dave, what you said is true. But a negative reaction to a post like that is inappropriate because people who love people will want to woo them, not condemn them. But it's not a natural reaction, and not always easy to do. And people who love banjos will act like they do until they can make beautiful music together.
wannabe
"Most people are bothered by those passages of Scripture they do not understand, but the passages that bother me are those I do understand." Mark Twain
bindle stiff jim - Posted - 02/02/2007: 14:57:06
i agree (and for the record, i don't worship satan). my point is things around here get extremely hypocritical. some religion is ok, as long as it doesn't appear in the heading. it can appear in every post somebody makes, but not in the subject line. the same courtesy isn't given to non-traditional christian beliefs. and that's not aimed at the moderators, site owner or rules. i'm talking about the "good, righteous" folks that, in the name of their beliefs, show such distain an vehemence towards people with different thoughts.
dave - banjo pickin' backpacker
midlothian, va
Edited by - bindle stiff jim on 02/02/2007 15:02:10
salvatone - Posted - 02/02/2007: 16:28:45
I was here during the religion and politics posting. I really got vicious, and I wouldn't have wanted to be a moderator. Right before the last election.
Salvatone
jbanjoist - Posted - 02/03/2007: 21:51:36
I think it'd be very interesting for the number of posts locked by a moderator to be listed along with the normal number of posts. Might be enlightening and enertaining.
Jbanjoist
Don't sweat the small stuff,
Oh yeah, it's ALL small stuff!
http://banjolounge.ivocalize.net/
jbanjoist - Posted - 02/04/2007: 09:30:38
While I know there would be issues with a "free for all" section there really needs to be less locking of topics. Many are locked without any apparent reason or just because the dialog becomes somewhat argumentative. People should be allowed to work out arguments if possible and many times a topic is locked at just a hint of trouble.
Some apparently think everyone should agree on everything everytime and we should act like a bunch of sheep blindly following the shephard of no conflict.
That just isn't how it is in the real world and if it were it would be exceedingly boring.
But having said that I'd like to say also that without moderation this site would be a mess in short order so a big thank you to the moderators for an overall fine job.
Jbanjoist
Don't sweat the small stuff,
Oh yeah, it's ALL small stuff!
http://banjolounge.ivocalize.net/
Edited by - jbanjoist on 02/04/2007 12:01:07
N.E.banjo - Posted - 02/04/2007: 19:57:06
I don't have to worry about the mods at all anymore where my own threads or posts are concerned. A den mother (with protected status) swoops in and judges the worth of threads I start or posts I make long before the mods can get there - and uses much much stricter standards for allowable content. It's not worth it for me to be in "Off Topic" any more. Just once in awhile. I get sized up at the door too often.
Dan
jbanjoist - Posted - 02/05/2007: 17:09:29
Could an explanation be given in a final post from the locking moderator? This might clear up any confusion on any members parts, help avoid any negative feelings and keep us members up on how not to get a topic locked.
I was wondering why the Stelling sticker shock topic was locked.............
Jbanjoist
Don't sweat the small stuff,
Oh yeah, it's ALL small stuff!
http://banjolounge.ivocalize.net/
garyblanchard - Posted - 02/05/2007: 18:04:55
I usually try to post an explanation when I lock a topic. I did not lock the Stelling Sticker Shock thread, but I can see that it went far from the original topic and had a lot of personal slams. It seems to me that maybe it was figured that it had outlived is usefullness. That's my guess.
Gary Blanchard
Preserving the Old-Time/Good-Time Tradition
http://www.brookfieldsmusic.net
Buy our CDs at http://kunaki.com/msales.asp?PublisherId=111162
Banjoman - Posted - 02/05/2007: 18:08:27
The reason the topic was locked are the reasons stated by Gary. If one knows the rules one should be able to see why a topic is locked or deleted.
Hugh
Playing since 1964
"If the banjo was any good, The Beatles would have used it."- Bill McEuen
Click Here: Banjo Hangout Rules & Guidelines.
Click Here: Bobby Thompson's Home Page
Edited by - Banjoman on 02/05/2007 18:11:25
jbanjoist - Posted - 02/06/2007: 19:42:55
LOL some people need slamming a bit when they act as if their opinion is the only one that matters. Too bad they can't be moderated.
OK. Moderate on and lock this one too cause it's outlived it's usefulness fo sho.
Now let's go read those pesky rules..................
Jbanjoist
Don't sweat the small stuff,
Oh yeah, it's ALL small stuff!
http://banjolounge.ivocalize.net/
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