budbennett - Posted - 12/26/2009:  18:50:26

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a while ago i really wanted a tenor neck for one of my banjos. i already had two tenor banjos, neither very good and i was really wanting something better to play since tenor had become sort of my main banjo to play lately. i thought i'd explore the idea of getting a tenor neck made and putting it either on my nechville or my stealth. one thougth led to another and i luckily stumbled upon a for sale ad where someone had a tenor neck for their nechville phantom for sale. i bought it and am here to report on it!

i love it. it's soooo easy to play, it has a great tone, it looks fantastic (walnut wood, maple binding and an ebony fingerboard), radius fingerboard, and switching from a 5 string neck to a tenor neck on a nechville takes all of about 5 minutes from start to finish.

EDIT:
a few folks have asked me about a sound file so i just added one. go easy on me though, i'm just a beginner and i can't get to my real recording stuff nowadays so this isn't optimal equipment or space etc etc etc.

here's a few photos:

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Edited by - budbennett on 01/11/2010 09:08:49

The World is Waiting for the Sunrise

My Golden - Posted - 12/27/2009:  00:14:41

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I am interested in Nechville's, got any sound files on yours? Looks like you did a great job on the necks.

banjopaolo - Posted - 12/27/2009:  01:21:45

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It's nice to see the fretboard completely clean without markers, don't you have problems with that? Or you have some markers on the binding of the fretboard? I do play without dots when I use my classic guitar but there are only 12 frets.....

budbennett - Posted - 12/27/2009:  06:25:12

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paolo- there are small dots on the binding to use as a guide. i didn't have any problems adjusting because one of my other banjos is a Stealth and that also has no inlay on it other than the dots on the binding.


no soundfile yet, i'm still trying to settle on a bridge type and height. soon i will be all settled though and then i'll record it.

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Edited by - budbennett on 12/27/2009 06:26:37

NYCJazz - Posted - 12/27/2009:  20:18:51

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Bud

That setup looks wicked! It was a stroke of luck finding that neck for sale!


Eddy Davis plays an electric Nechville that's awesome!

budbennett - Posted - 12/28/2009:  07:42:04

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it sure was a stroke of luck Nathan. i had sort of given up on the idea because of money issues (i had a team of plumbers in my house for a solid month this fall!), so stumbling on the ad JUST after i'd sold a banjo told me it was supposed to happen. i'm really happy about it- my bandmates are very happy as well. sure is easier to play than what i had been playing.

RUBY2 - Posted - 01/03/2010:  01:00:19

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Bud

That is one fine looking Banjo! What a looker. If it plays half as good as it looks I am sure it will be amazing.

Cheers

Richard

nechville - Posted - 01/07/2010:  06:31:41

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Tenor has not been a focus for us so far, but we are planning a production model tenor, and I wonder what do people want? 17 or 19 fret? We can always take custom requests but, I am mostly interested in what the Irish and Europeans are after. I am imagining offering a more classic style peghead and moderate inlays. Any difference in where the inlay markers go on a Tenor? Any guidance you can give would be helpful. Thanks Tom

budbennett - Posted - 01/07/2010:  08:17:35

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i have two other tenor banjos, both 19 fret types, they both have fret markers on frets 3, 5, 7, 10 (this is where the double marker is on both of mine, not at the 12th) 12, 15 and one has a marker on the 17th the other does not.

NYCJazz - Posted - 01/07/2010:  08:46:45

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From what I understand, the European standard is 19 frets for both jazz and irish playing.

Eddy Davis (musical director of Woody Allen's jazz band) told me he prefers 17 fret scale because of the more relaxed string tension. I've never played anything but 19 fret, so I can't speak to the difference, but the high string tension was a major problem I had with tenor. It was one of the reasons I switched to plectrum.

Don't ask me about fret markers! My Silver Bell has a custom set that no one I've met can explain:

DanielT - Posted - 01/07/2010:  09:06:32

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quote:

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Originally posted by nechville

we are planning a production model tenor...am mostly interested in what the Irish and Europeans are after. I am imagining offering a more classic style peghead and moderate inlays.

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Exciting!

If you're thinking something for the Irish players out there, I think you want something with 19 frets (markers go at 3, 5, 7, 10, 12, 15, 17 and 19) with a more "classic" style peghead is probably a good idea--I think that's where the market is. Also, most of the Irish-made banjos I've seen have been archtops (40 hole and "pyramid" style) and have been very bright and "focused" sounding. As far as new builds go, I've also seen lots of maple banjos with ebony fretboards.

Love the idea.

nechville - Posted - 01/07/2010:  10:29:43

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I am doing a little market research to see what people may be likely to buy, If it were me, I'd opt for more frets and higher string tension from the longer scale, but what do I know? I know tenors are tuned in 5ths, but is it true that 19 fret tenors are tuned different than 17?

Choosing a Banjo

DanielT - Posted - 01/07/2010:  10:39:36

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quote:

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Originally posted by nechville

I am doing a little market research to see what people may be likely to buy, If it were me, I'd opt for more frets and higher string tension from the longer scale, but what do I know? I know tenors are tuned in 5ths, but is it true that 19 fret tenors are tuned different than 17?

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Research? I love research! Let me throw in my two cents:

To dispel a myth: there's a common perception that 17 frets equals "Irish tenor banjo." I don't really know where this perception came from, but I know very, very few banjo players who play on a 17 fret instrument. In fact, I'm usually turned off by tenors that have 18 or 20 frets...19 seems to be the rule. (I'm also turned off by jumbo frets.)

As for tension: I prefer a higher string tension, but it's hard because Irish players typically tune G-D-A-E (low to high) and compensate the low string tension of this tuning with heavier strings. I use .12, .18, .26, .38 because I like the feel and sound, but wouldn't mind them to have a little more tension to them (is that a function of construction?).

NYCJazz - Posted - 01/07/2010:  11:24:37

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Tom

Lots of Irish players DO play archtop banjos. I'd like to suggest using a Paramount archtop for construction inspiration, rather than the typical Gibson clones.

Daniel

I believe the string tension is a function of scale length at the same tuning and string gauge. Longer = more tension.

DanielT - Posted - 01/07/2010:  11:49:45

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quote:

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Originally posted by NYCJazz

I believe the string tension is a function of scale length at the same tuning and string gauge. Longer = more tension.

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Yeah, I should have written "is that [i]also]/i] a function of construction?" I thought I'd read something somewhere that string tension can also have something to do with construction, but I'm probably wrong.

mikeyes - Posted - 01/07/2010:  12:14:12

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String tension has to do with the gauge of the strings and the scale of the banjo. Typically a 19 fret banjo is in the 23 inch range and string tension with GDAE tuning is about the same as cgda tuning with smaller gauge strings.

As for which neck to use, go with the 19 fret banjo. It is much more commonly used for Irish music in spite of what the makers of "Irish tenor banjos" say. Fret markers are as Dan said and a classical headstock is a little more comfortable to look at for an Irish musician, but that's because they have never seen anything else :grin:

I really like the idea of being able to change necks on a banjo in just a few minutes.

As for the tone ring, etc., yes most of the new European banjos have arch top rings but Angelina Carberry plays a banjo with what looks like a Sullivan flathead ring and it sounds great. There is no "Scruggs sound" in Irish music, rather each manufacturer has a signature sound. My favorite banjos right now are a TB-7 tribute and a Masterclone archtop that I made. I don't think you can go wrong with a well made banjo no matter what you use for a tone ring.

Mike Keyes
(No, not that one.)

budbennett - Posted - 01/07/2010:  12:40:25

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quote:

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Originally posted by mikeyes



I really like the idea of being able to change necks on a banjo in just a few minutes.


Mike Keyes
(No, not that one.)

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i just want to comment on this part of your post mike- i truly did change the neck of my nechville from a 5 string to a tenor in about 5 minutes. i'll bet if i hadn't been using new strings it would have been a little quicker too! the neck comes off the nechville (after loosening the strings) pot by turning one screw. when the neck is off, the strings and tailpiece come off as one unit basically. it really could not be easier!

Michael Coleman - Posted - 01/07/2010:  12:55:22

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Daniel,

I was just wondering what it is about 18 frets that turns you off. I don't have a tenor banjo, but the few times I've tried some out I couldn't tell much difference between 17 and 19 fret models.

It seems like 18 would be a happy medium.

Michael.

nechville - Posted - 01/07/2010:  14:02:46

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Good Posts, You guys are confirming some things and adding to my understanding of Tenor Banjo.
Does this sound like an acceptable list of specs?
19 frets around 23" scale?
Classic Peghead- moderate inlay like Diamond wing
Choice of Mahogany or Maple
Comfort Bevel armrest
Archtop Tonering (how about with Delrin Cyclotronics for a dryer sound??)
Slightly wider neck than some with slight radius
Wide frets- (rounded and dressed)
String gauge for irish Tuning What do you suggest?
Type of Head- Frosted or not?
5/8" 2 footed bridge? or 3? What is weight of a Tenor bridge, my guess is under 2 grams

budbennett - Posted - 01/07/2010:  14:41:56

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three footed bridge gets my vote. frosted head for sure.

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Edited by - budbennett on 01/07/2010 14:44:03

NYCJazz - Posted - 01/07/2010:  14:44:54

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Everything sounds great, Tom!

I prefer top frosted heads and 3-footed bridges.

BTW This is much more interesting than the FQMS design "contest"!

I can see this actually being something different and important!

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Edited by - NYCJazz on 01/07/2010 14:50:20

DanielT - Posted - 01/07/2010:  16:02:07

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quote:

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Originally posted by nechville

You guys are confirming some things and adding to my understanding of Tenor Banjo.
Does this sound like an acceptable list of specs?

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Yep, sounds pretty good. Love the idea of a slightly wider neck. I'd prefer a 22 5/8" or 22 7/8" over a 23" scale. (I think this is closer to the Paramount/Gibson scale which I like.) Not that my opinion means all that much, but I'd love to see a walnut neck wood option. The diamond wing inlay is nice...I also like the antler inlay (but I could also go without inlay all together). Head type isn't a huge issue because they can be changed easily enough, but I prefer plain white heads...I don't use top-frosted heads because sometimes I drag my right hand ring finger and when I do that with a frosted head I sand my fingernail off, which is be painful. (I wonder if there are other players who do that as well.) Bridge type isn't a real issue either unless the FB will definitely be radiused, in which case I prefer 3 foot bridges (and the ones I like are in the 1.6-1.8 range).

quote:

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Originally posted by Michael Coleman

I was just wondering what it is about 18 frets that turns you off.

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Well...sometimes I like to play up an octave and I don't really play the "Bb" on the first string. If your neck is only 18 frets, there's no "B" to reach (19th fret) and the extra fret seems superfluous. On a 17 fret banjo, your highest note is an "A" (and the shorter scale makes it kinda tight up there). I feel like if you're going to have 18, you might as well have 19, especially if we're talking about a new banjo model.

NYCJazz - Posted - 01/08/2010:  08:17:42

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Last night I went to my lesson at Cynthia's, and she had just emailed Tom!

Seems Tom has been reaching out to the plectrum community, too!

He wanted to know what Cynthia's dream banjo would be. She said that she wanted a banjo that was as light as possible without sacrificing sound, plus she wants to be able to plug it into an amp when needed.

I said that if anyone has the skill and desire to do it, it's Tom.

I hope we'll see a Cynthia Sayer model Nechville plectrum banjo soon. I hope to own one, too!

budbennett - Posted - 01/11/2010:  20:06:59

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i hope you do get one nathan, nechvilles really are way cool.