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jason holgate - Posted - 11/19/2009: 13:53:07
i would love to see a banjo maker build a comparable banjo say to a florentine or a bela voce even a painted resonator and neck like a tb 11 nothing crazy dont have to be ornately carved or gold plated i think the paint makes a different sound
jason holgate - Posted - 11/19/2009: 14:39:30
hey that recording king is nice is that a tone ring banjo and you dont think the paint on the resonator affects the tone or sound at all ? i thought it would but i am not knowledgable on banjo info just like playing them when my wife asked me how many i need i told her all of them
beegee - Posted - 11/19/2009: 23:35:12
quote:
Originally posted by jason holgate
hey that recording king is nice is that a tone ring banjo and you dont think the paint on the resonator affects the tone or sound at all ? i thought it would but i am not knowledgable on banjo info just like playing them when my wife asked me how many i need i told her all of them
Paint on the inside might affect the sound, but you'd have to be Superman or a dog to detect a difference. The type of wood and the curvature of the dish would make a more significant contribution to sound than the coating on the outside. I've been working on a parts banjo that someone layered the inside of the resonator with fiberglass cloth and resin and then sanded it. The resonator is very heavy and the banjo sounds dull in the higher frequencies. I didn't keep it long enough to swap resonators, but I'm think about getting it back to tinker with some more.
Ronnie - Posted - 11/20/2009: 07:14:05
Janet Deering commented about resonators on another thread. She concurs that MOTS overlays ( and obviously paint) do not noticeably affect banjo tone. Greg is toying with the idea of making some fancy decorated resonators.
Polle Flaunoe - Posted - 11/20/2009: 09:01:30
On f.ex. a B&D Silver Bell the resonator is partly floating - meaning that the resonator is attached to the rim via a somehow flexible thin and perforated brass flange.
On these banjos the resonators own and free "swingings" add very much to the overall sound.
In order benefitting from this youīll have to sit down and hold the banjo almost free of your body.
The late 20s plus 30s models/versions have extra large resonators and stepped flanges - the resonator sound addition is even more prominent for these.
Bacon did build laminated resonators with either an outer veneer or a Pyralin covering for their SBīs.
I have cross tested these two types on various SBīs - the resonators with Pyralin covering add substantialy more and better to the overall sound.
On banjos with a stiff flange like f.ex. a Mastertone type Iīve never experienced the resonator adding something like this.
Regards
Polle
PS!
Iīve been told, that some proīs - including Buddy Wachter - have experimented with cutting the rim free of the flange on SBīs and assemble the flange and rim only via 4 rubber joints. This is told to add even more of the resonators free swingings to the overall sound - in a positive way. Iīve not tried this myself.
PPS!
And yes - I know, that the resonator due holding is a fixed part - itīs the rest of the banjo, that can swing somehow free of the resonator.
beegee - Posted - 11/20/2009: 13:21:56
The notion that paint on the outside of a resonator affects the sound is like thinking the color of paint affects the speed of a car. Black cars just LOOK faster than white ones.
BNJOMAKR - Posted - 11/20/2009: 14:02:02
That's why I painted the bottom half white, to slow down the top half!
"Those who never try... never will!"
vtyankee5 - Posted - 11/29/2009: 15:33:01
I heard American Made Banjo was toying with the idea of the florentine design.
3fingers - Posted - 11/29/2009: 15:56:16
Bob I bought a resonator that had been refinished and when they refinished it they finished the inside of the resonator. I had this on a parts banjo and had it over at my buddies house who has a 34 TB/RB-3 conversion. We swapped resonators just out of curiosity and there was a pretty big difference. His pre war was a little louder but also thinner sounding with the finished resonator and my parts banjo had a fuller sound and that D string had a little more growl to it. The only thng is I dont know how much of it was the pre war resonator or if it was the other resonator being finished on the inside that made the diffrence. I kinda figured it was probably a little of both.
Craig
beegee - Posted - 11/29/2009: 21:44:47
There is a big difference when talking about finishing the inside of a resonator vs. the outside. As previously mentioned, I had a banjo in my shop where the builder heavily fiberglassed the inside, hoping to do who-knows-what? The resonator was absolutely dead. When I get it back this week, I'm going to put another resonator on it and compare the sound. I may even do a sound-file of each test.
Edited by - beegee on 11/29/2009 21:46:00
3fingers - Posted - 11/30/2009: 15:27:22
I would be interested in hearing in the outcome of it if it isnt to much of a bother. My buddy and myself have messed around some trying different things with resonators seeing what effects they have on both volume and tone. Oh and I would love to know the thought process behind fiberglassing the inside of that resonator LOL
Craig
Edited by - 3fingers on 11/30/2009 15:35:10
beegee - Posted - 12/01/2009: 05:38:05
There is a difference between a coat of thin shellac and a thick coating of fiberglass resin and glass cloth.
The original post asked about the decorative painting on the OUTSIDE of a resonator, like a Bella Voce or Florentine, and its effect on sound. I stand by my opinion that it makes no difference.
TR Dockery - Posted - 12/01/2009: 06:06:25
I have to wonder if the MOTS covering on 11s and such doesn't contribute to their characteristic "tubbiness". I have also heard at least one very well known Nashville luthier claim that an ebony fingerboard sounds different from rosewood; if that is true, it seems to me that MOTS would have an effect, too. I'm just sayin'.
Regards,
Randy in Germantown, TN
5stringypsy - Posted - 12/01/2009: 08:27:54
funny how things work  just this week I was workin in my buddy's shop and he was putting some final setup touches on a banjer he'd just completed and told me to grab a resonator off the shelf, and I did.. And the banjo just didn't suit me.. He said grab that other one there .. and I did.. good night son.. what a difference! (he knew what he was doin, kinda demonstrating to me without tellin me) so I tried a couple other on it, different woods (mahogany, walnut, etc.) and they sounded within reason close to each other then put that first one back on and ugh.... then, being AS SHARP AS I AM.. hehe  NOT! I noticed the paint and finish on the entire inside of the resonator had been scraped off.. I understand the impact from the interior finish and shape of the resonator plain as day now.
beegee - Posted - 12/01/2009: 13:57:13
I like a thin glossy finish inside the resonator. I usually use black lacquer and just enough coats to where the grain is still visible.
3fingers - Posted - 12/01/2009: 15:30:43
For what its worth heres something right from the Gibson website LOL
From Gibson
quote:
The RB-75VL is also finished with an older formulation of lacquer that replicates the vintage lacquer used on pre-war RB-75 banjos and lets the wood breath with less restraint, helping to free up the tone of the instrument.
I have a RB-75 VL and that thing is a cannon but I'd say the Charlie Cushman set up had more to do with that than the finish but maybe they are, to some extent,right about the finish, I dont know.
Edited by - 3fingers on 12/01/2009 17:02:44
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