PBGuardsman - Posted - 11/15/2009:  13:38:13

Hey everyone,

It seems like on all the high end banjos have planetary tuners instead of guitar style tuners. What's reason behind this? Thanks for your time,

Paul

"The world and its desires pass away, but the man who does the will of God lives forever." 1 John 2:17 (NIV)

Axeman79 - Posted - 11/15/2009:  14:11:28

Planetary gears are far more efficient and reliable than a 90 degree gear due to the interior and exterior gear wheel, so I'm guessing one reason is because planetary tuners are better. Also, I think they look better than guitar tuners.

Axeman

If the minimum wasn't good enough...it wouldn't be the minimum.

erstokke - Posted - 11/15/2009:  14:20:12

I think it is tradition. The planetary tuners look more like old fashioned tuning pegs.

I think guitar tuners are more reliable and more precise - and much cheaper. But they look kind og entry level.


My banjo is pre-war. Pre the next war
Jan Erik from Norway

mainejohn - Posted - 11/15/2009:  14:33:10

Guitar tuners such as Grover Rotomatics were all the rage on longnecks back in the 50's and 60's possibly because of the lack of quality planetaries available at that time. Pete Seeger and Dave Guard (among others) set the style and it persists to this day on Vega longnecks. I use them on mine more to maintain the style, but I prefer planetaries as they are just more practical. I do recall seeing an album cover indicating that Eric Weissburg used them on his Gibson back in the early 60's.

Cheers,
John Coleman
Scarborough, Maine

Edited by - mainejohn on 11/15/2009 14:36:25

Oalbrets - Posted - 11/15/2009:  15:17:52

I wanted to put planetary tuners on my Deering Boston and when I took it to my luthier Frank Ford he told me that the 90 degree tuners or actually better and then the planetary tuners. I left them on. I think the planetary tuners just look better.

Poverty Ridge Bluegrass

oldwoodchuckb - Posted - 11/15/2009:  16:57:15

What is better? Is better having a 14:1 gear ratio that even a deaf man should be able to eventually match the tuner? Or is it better having a 4:1 ratio gear that allows you to retune a string a full tone with two twists, or a halftone with one?

Guitarists love their 14:1 tuners - at least guitarists that don't use many tunings.
Banjo players, particularly old time banjo players, who might use up to 6 tunings in an evenings playing, want 4:1 to change tunings quickly. Unfortunately there are only two 4:1 5th strings pegs on the market.

Many bluegrass players never leave G tuning, and still planetary pegs are the standard on bluegrass banjos. Many guitarists have several tunings but still use 14:1 Rotomatic style tuners. The two people I've met with those Martin planetary peg guitars were both pretty much standard tuning types.


http://www.rocketsciencebanjo.com
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oldwoodchuckb - Posted - 11/15/2009:  16:58:42

What is better? Is better having a 14:1 gear ratio that even a deaf man should be able to eventually match the tuner? Or is it better having a 4:1 ratio gear that allows you to retune a string a full tone with two twists, or a halftone with one?

Guitarists love their 14:1 tuners - at least guitarists that don't use many tunings.
Banjo players, particularly old time banjo players, who might use up to 6 tunings in an evenings playing, want 4:1 to change tunings quickly. Unfortunately there are only two 4:1 5th strings pegs on the market.

Many bluegrass players never leave G tuning, and still planetary pegs are the standard on bluegrass banjos. Many guitarists have several tunings but still use 14:1 Rotomatic style tuners. The two people I've met with those Martin planetary peg guitars were both pretty much standard tuning types.


http://www.rocketsciencebanjo.com
Rocket Science Banjo - Advanced Clawhammer Techniques for beginners and long time players alike. Plus videos and 25-40 EZ Clawhammer Tunes.
& check out "How To Mold A Mighty Pinky" at:
http://www.pricklypearmusic.net
banjo brad's great banjo site

Oalbrets - Posted - 11/15/2009:  17:07:45

That makes sence to me Chuck and thanks.

Poverty Ridge Bluegrass

uncle.fogey - Posted - 11/15/2009:  17:18:54

I think of it as stylistic. I have 2 Pete Seeger type longnecks and use Grover Rotomatics and Grover 5th string friction pegs on both, because that's what's appropriate on that era and kind of banjo (I'm a traditionalist). I would NEVER use them on my Mastertone.

On Vega longneck era banjos, I would use Grover Rotomatic tuners and friction 5th string pegs to be historically accurate.

On ANY OTHER banjo, I would use planetary type straight-through tuners. and a planetary 5th string tuner (not the kind that has the post sticking up) 4-1 or 14-1 is not an issue - one is faster than the other, but both are FAR superior to friction pegs. If you can tune it, you can tune it. If you can't, get a digital thingy and a compensated bridge.


A man wouldn't need many plastic heads in a lifetime.

PBGuardsman - Posted - 11/15/2009:  21:31:58

Thanks oldwoodchuck.

I see the advantage of the 4-1 when one has to retune quickly.

That being said, does either one hold better? Does one have a tendency to break down over the other? or is it simply a question of who designed it? If a highly designed guitar style tuner is tested against a highly designed planetary tuner, what are the differences (besides ratio) going to be?

Thanks for dealin with my questions.

"The world and its desires pass away, but the man who does the will of God lives forever." 1 John 2:17 (NIV)

5stringpicker2 - Posted - 11/16/2009:  09:22:10

I myself just don't like the looks of Guitar style tuners. I change them out when ever I pick up a used Banjo with them on it.

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snakeherd - Posted - 11/16/2009:  10:07:33

In my experience (limited), guitar tuners are smoother, more accurate and hold better. But they don't have 'the look' and as olwoodchuck reminds us, they are really slow.

Scott

Thor - Posted - 11/16/2009:  10:32:02

I have both:

Kevin B - Posted - 11/16/2009:  14:06:50

Some people have written that elaborate peghead shapes require straight pegs versus 90 degree. I have seen some old tenors that probably wouldn't have the room for most guitar style pegs.

Kevin ( )=='=~

'Possum, It's what's for dinner . . ."

uncle.fogey - Posted - 11/16/2009:  14:39:32

I think 4:1 is more than enough. a friction peg is 1:1 I only use the 14:1 Rotomatics for the vintage look of a Seeger longneck because I am a traditionalist. They are a pain to tune, especially when you are reaching W A Y O U T T H E R E with a longneck.

A man wouldn't need many plastic heads in a lifetime.