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beeliner - Posted - 11/14/2009: 09:49:39
I am leaving BHO, it seems every time I make a post it only draws anger and criticism. I have tried to post things that would be helpful to folks. Anyway this will be my last post. I will be canceling my account. I would like to say that I have met some good friends here and I certainly appreciate them. I will leave my account open for a few days if anyone wants to send email. Fair you well.
beeliner. Revis Martin. When a man's ways please the Lord, he maketh even his enemies to be at peace with him. Proverbs 16:7 [KJV]
Nancy - Posted - 11/14/2009: 10:00:10
I will miss you. You are a good man. Let me know how you are, please.
Nancy
We Create Our Tomorrows by what we dream today.
KE - Posted - 11/14/2009: 10:14:33
Fare well, Revis. I wish you health and peace.
jbanjoist - Posted - 11/14/2009: 10:14:34
Revis I dropped you a mail. Hate to see you go.
Jbanjoist
I'm a NECHVILLIAN!
EDUMACATE YOSEF!
You don't know until you KNOW.
Post unto others as you would have them post unto you.
dbaty - Posted - 11/14/2009: 10:21:15
Don't go. Don't let someone run you off. Some people just like to keep it stirred up on Forum sites and see people leave. Don't be one of them.
Like a Dog, a Banjo just wants to be played with and cared for.
Sheldon - Posted - 11/14/2009: 10:26:13
Come over to Banjo Mafia . . . . . Ladies and gentlemen live there!!!!!
Sheldon
BConk - Posted - 11/14/2009: 11:38:02
quote:
Originally posted by beeliner
I am leaving BHO, it seems every time I make a post it only draws anger and criticism. I have tried to post things that would be helpful to folks. Anyway this will be my last post. I will be canceling my account. I would like to say that I have met some good friends here and I certainly appreciate them. I will leave my account open for a few days if anyone wants to send email. Fair you well.
beeliner. Revis Martin. When a man's ways please the Lord, he maketh even his enemies to be at peace with him. Proverbs 16:7 [KJV]
You and I have had some fallings out - and I'm not saying this is the cause of your decision - but if it was then I wouldn't leave because of my reaction to some of your posts if I were you. But if you find that many people react with anger and criticism then maybe you ought to consider that what you're posting is inappropriate in the first place.  "Defender of the Sacred Cod" Capio pisces, ergo sum
mogultx - Posted - 11/14/2009: 11:55:17
Revis,
I sent you a PM. I respect who you are and what you stand for. I will miss your posts here on the BHO.
With the decline in respect and tolerance here on the BHO, I think there will be some others to follow in short order.
I wish you all the best.
Monty
noli illegitimi carborundum (stolen from DAT)
Kevin B - Posted - 11/14/2009: 12:25:07
I appreciate you Revis. You have always been ready to help a guy out. Thanks for all of your contributions to the BHO discussions.
Kevin ( )=='=~
'Possum, It's what's for dinner . . ."
Banjoitus - Posted - 11/14/2009: 19:14:49
Revis, I surely wish you'd reconsider, you are a good man, and I will miss seeing your avatar on the site everyday. As someone suggested if you are bent on leaving, try the "other" banjo sites they may be more to your liking. I truly don't know why I keep coming back, just a habit I suppose, there are precious few of the folks on here that were on the BHO when I first started posting. Wherever they went, I miss 'em each and everyone, as I will miss you when you're gone.
Brian T - Posted - 11/14/2009: 20:03:46
Via con Deos.
We do not know where we are going.
Nor do most of us care.
For us, it is enough that we are on our way.
Le Matelot
mike gregory - Posted - 11/14/2009: 20:03:53
In the original, unabbreviated meaning of "goodbye", which was, and still is "God Be With Ye",
I shalll bid you good-bye.
Still, you have not made a vow to leave, and may change your mind. Or return. Or log on at any of the other banjo sites. It's a world of many possibilities.
jbanjoist - Posted - 11/14/2009: 20:10:13
I was one of the first too and I find myself coming here a lot less than I used too.
It's clear Revis is feeling down and a shame that it has come to that.
But I understand it since even in his goodbye post he has had to bear someone still trying to tell him he's in the wrong.
Well he doesn't have to worry about it anymore.
Best wishes Revis and check out some of the other sites where this stuff isn't so prevalent.
I might do the same.
Jbanjoist
I'm a NECHVILLIAN!
EDUMACATE YOSEF!
You don't know until you KNOW.
Post unto others as you would have them post unto you.
Ronnie - Posted - 11/14/2009: 20:16:47
Sorry to see you go. We have had fun. Hope you will change your mind about leaving or take a short breathing spell and rejoin us in the near future.
www.bobbythompsonbanjo.com
fivestring2 - Posted - 11/14/2009: 20:30:34
Revis, you have always been fair and a friend to me. You sent me an email when I was beat up here that I will never forget. A few of us are at the Banjo Holler now. This is not a shameless plug...just a choice. We allow religious and political discussion and so far there have been no problems. All the banjo forums can work in tandem to allow the users to find out what's best for them. The Banjo Holler may not be your cup of tea either. But it's just another choice. Consider all your options before you decide.
barbie
Check out www.banjoholler.com I double dare you!!!
steve davis - Posted - 11/14/2009: 20:36:19
Don't slam the door,Revis.You might change your mind,later.
N.E.banjo - Posted - 11/14/2009: 20:45:29
Religion and politics at the Banjo Holler are sequestered in a protected area on an "opt-in" basis.
Dan
steve davis - Posted - 11/15/2009: 05:50:02
I've read all kinds of stuff that I don't agree with on here.I expect that
will always be the case.
Moxley - Posted - 11/15/2009: 06:55:48
Revis,
You must stick around my ole friend. You do an outstanding job at voicing your opinion, which is shared by many members. There's a lot of truth to the saying ‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’.
Doug
SJL - Posted - 11/15/2009: 07:10:29
Revis,
I'm sorry see you go, but I can understand why. You will be missed.
Steve
"If the woman is alive at the end of the song, it ain't Bluegrass".
2007 Hatfield Walnut Custom
1976 (?) Aria Pro Tree of Life
Don Borchelt - Posted - 11/15/2009: 07:11:33
BConk wrote: "But if you find that many people react with anger and criticism then maybe you ought to consider that what you're posting is inappropriate in the first place."
I think this is a hard point that sadly must be made, and Brian deserves credit for having the courage to say it. If you can't stand the heat, don't light the match. I say that as someone who has occasionally lit a few matches myself.
I think Beeliner is foolishly overreacting, but it is his call.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"My mission in life is really very simple. I want to make somebody's dinner better." - Chef Paul Prudhomme
Check out my webpage.
Edited by - Don Borchelt on 11/15/2009 07:22:43
Compass56 - Posted - 11/15/2009: 07:31:34
Because I'm mainly a tenor banjoist who dabbles in 5-string, I tend to read and react to posts in the 4-string forum only. I don't know anything about the controversy and anger to which you alluded in your original post. I do know that when I have run across your posts, I've always been impressed with your knowledge, wisdom, and the strength of your beliefs. How others (including myself) feel about those beliefs is immaterial. You're one of the good guys. I hope you find a way to stay on the BHO. I have learned much from you and wish to continue to do so.
Gomer - Posted - 11/15/2009: 07:35:12
Oh Come on Revis. . . You won't let a couple of malcontent leftists get to you. You have a lot to contribute and it would be a sin not to do so, You don't want to be a sinner, do you? or course not.
All you have to do is to hit the reset button and call ally-ally-out'n'free! Go Ahead. Do it now!
( )=====’==::
Abundant Opinions - Speculative Advice - Marginal Judgment
Sheldon - Posted - 11/15/2009: 08:39:25
Line forms on the right to kick Revis one more time as he leaves.
Once again, Revis, come over to Banjo Mafia . . . . . . . Ladies and Gentlemen are there.
Sheldon
Don Borchelt - Posted - 11/15/2009: 09:16:56
Sheldon wrote: "Line forms on the right to kick Revis one more time as he leaves."
"A fool despiseth his father's instruction: but he that regardeth reproof is prudent." Proverbs 15:5 (KJV)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"My mission in life is really very simple. I want to make somebody's dinner better." - Chef Paul Prudhomme
Check out my webpage.
JSnood - Posted - 11/15/2009: 10:44:51
I have had my run ins with Revis and here's what I have to add to all this. The Internet is rife with incivility and for the most part the relative anonymity and ease with which the "Submit" button is pushed make us all guilty of it on occasion.
Sometimes when I feel attacked or when I feel that I have been too much on the attack, I simply take a week off. I don't read, I don't post.
If beeliner is reading this, my advice would to disappear for a while and come back when he's feeling less negative.
Raphael Lasar
Matawan, NJ
The more something is described as "unbelievable", the simpler the explanation for it will be.
Richard Dress - Posted - 11/15/2009: 11:11:02
Revis,
Your leaving the field could be taken as an admission of defeat. A belief in no god has the same philosophical standing as a religious belief, so don't let the atheists push you around. Most of them only repeat dogma that their college professors told them and have no understanding of their actual position in the realm of reason. They are only stating their college beliefs, which they probably haven't even finished paying for yet.
Banjoitus - Posted - 11/15/2009: 11:40:52
A belief in no god has the same philosophical standing as a religious belief, so don't let the atheists push you around.
You have swerved into a basic myth and fact of the BHO. The myth is that no political or religious posts are allowed on the BHO. Not so, one can spout all day long about almost anything regarding their being an Atheist, but let someone counter with anything even vaguely religious and whoa mule!
Poppy himself violated every rule in the book with his post on the recent execution of a serial killer, but well, that's a moderator from whom we've had dire notice that he will pounce on you if you get out of line. We all know what he SHOULD DO ACCORDING TO HAS OWN ADMONITION!
I have been here for years and seen a lot of scuffling, but to beat up on someone in their seventies who is absolutely right most of the time, but for the changing of the rules of the world is pretty low even for this site.
Kicking me off this site would be equal to the loss of a sale paper from my mailbox so do what you will I've spoken the truth.
Louisiana Rose - Posted - 11/15/2009: 12:03:58
I am so sorry that you feel this way, I wish there was something I could say to make you change your mind
If you are gonna be out of date, do it right
Dr. Jug - Posted - 11/15/2009: 12:35:41
"When a man's ways please the Lord, he maketh even his enemies to be at peace with him."
Hmmm.
I remember a time when I posted an opinion, that old-time picking styles generally make better accompaniment for a solo singer than bluegrass patterns do. I got some astonishing personal abuse from some ridiculous man who said I was criticizing Bluegrass music, had less musical ability than his three-year-old daughter, & had no right to an opinion because I don't live in a Blue Grass State. It was so vitriolic and hostile that it was nearly funny.
I think we just have to thank such people for the opportunity to practise restraint & dignity, & move on. Set an example, rather than walk away.
Just a suggestion!
"...mmm, it sounds so sweet..."
Edited by - Dr. Jug on 11/15/2009 12:37:26
chip arnold - Posted - 11/15/2009: 12:45:05
Richard, FWIW, there are plenty of atheists (I'm not one) who have arrived at their understanding of things after long and sincere thought.
There are also many believers who are not at all in agreement with the commonly held fundamentalist thinking but whose understanding is also the result of sincere searching.
And there are countless fundamentalists whose understanding amounts to nothing more than the sort of "learning" you atribute to athiests.
Militancy from a "believer" and militancy from an "unbeliever" contain the same error.
Revis, there are plenty of on-line forums where you can discuss your beliefs with likeminded folks. And we can all talk a little about those things on the BHO without getting shut down. But on a 40K banjo forum, we're all going to find ourselves in disagreement with others at times. I think that if you enjoy posting on the banjo threads, you should stick around. If you want to post on the quasi religous or political threads, just be ready to take your lumps like the rest of us.
**********************
Take what is given
Give what is taken
Chip Arnold
Richard Dress - Posted - 11/15/2009: 13:33:03
Chip,
What you say is true: some people have arrived at their beliefs after long and serious thought. Most people have not done so; they have just been told by a preacher or a professor and that's what they go with. No big deal--that's just the way people are.
But some people who don't believe in a god seem to think that they are somehow intellectually superior; they look down on religion, when all they have to fall back on when pressed is as a stale intellectual position which is at the bottom just more religious dogma in a different form. But it is really no different than the revealed theology that they disparage.
This is a pernicious form of intellectual bullying that I find very offensive. Especially it disturbs me when you look at religious rprejudice as just a small part of a wider tendency in most non-technical disciplines to treat their dogmas in the same way: looking down their nose at all aspects of Western culture and basing their disdain on the same specious dogma purveyed by their professors who are equally steeped in dogma rather than reason and rigorous explorations of truth.
MYLO - Posted - 11/15/2009: 13:54:21
Hate to hear it. Revis. Take care buddy. I'll send you my email address.
" I want it to sound,,,, like a DANG BANJER!!"
chip arnold - Posted - 11/15/2009: 14:05:09
Two sides of the same coin. There is ample looking down the nose going on amongst those who think themselves religous towards those who don't. And there is an abundance of us Westerners looking down our noses at non Western cultures.
The more secure a feller is in his experience of truth and understanding, the less he leans toward thinking himself superior as a bolster for his insecurities. And the less bothered he is when he senses himself to be the object of same.
My opinions and $1.20 will get you a cup of coffee in some places :-)
**********************
Take what is given
Give what is taken
Chip Arnold
Banjoitus - Posted - 11/15/2009: 14:05:28
Atheist can pound their chests and proclaim there is no God, but just wait until the grim reaper comes, then we can tell if they were a REAL atheist. Old John Wayne got religion at the end, before his church was compromised of the mountains and rivers, but when it got down to time to climb in that coffin, he seen the light. Lots of 'em do.
Me, I think if religion helps a man to part with his kin and friends, then more power to him. If you have to hold a loved one in your arms and watch them leave this world, I don't expect you can offer them much comfort by saying: Well buddy this is it, hope you enjoyed your time here cause that's all there is, see ya, er make that saw ya.
It's my sincere desire that no one should have to just wither and go. Some might have the stomach for it, but most don't. Soldiers dying often call out to their mothers. Pilots call on both deity and self on loosing an aircraft. I'll bet if you could be there when they croak, not many atheist say, man this is cool, no more anything.
KE - Posted - 11/15/2009: 14:19:49
You may be assuming that having a disagreement with beeliner's positions on any given subject means you're an atheist; maybe, maybe not. Without going into specifics, there's a long list of possibilities for disagreement with Revis, as would be true for any other person who participates in discussions.
That said, this thread is for saying goodbye to Revis, and once again, I will wish him peace in any destination of his choosing.
Edited by - KE on 11/15/2009 14:29:22
Banjoitus - Posted - 11/15/2009: 14:33:27
KE:
You are right of course. So long Revis and I hope you are happy where ever you go, or what ever you do.
bosborne - Posted - 11/15/2009: 15:12:17
quote:
Originally posted by beeliner
I am leaving BHO, it seems every time I make a post it only draws anger and criticism. I have tried to post things that would be helpful to folks. Anyway this will be my last post. I will be canceling my account. I would like to say that I have met some good friends here and I certainly appreciate them. I will leave my account open for a few days if anyone wants to send email. Fair you well.
beeliner. Revis Martin. When a man's ways please the Lord, he maketh even his enemies to be at peace with him. Proverbs 16:7 [KJV]
Revis, you are being wise. You and I are frequently on opposite sides but my thought here has to do with people who find themselves on any side of the debates we see here. If the B in BHO seems to signify more battle than banjo then something's wrong. And it is an illusion, a fantasy, to think that you or I or anyone else can change someone's outlook on life through posting, and arguing, here. Those of you who are thinking that Revis is being driven out by the "opposite side" or that he is capitulating are mistaken, that's not what he is saying. He is saying that the battle is not satisfying him, that the person in the battle is not the person he wants to be right now. If you don't believe me check his signature. I admire what he's expressing here, I have to say.
BConk - Posted - 11/15/2009: 15:38:57
quote:
Originally posted by jbanjoist
It's clear Revis is feeling down and a shame that it has come to that.
But I understand it since even in his goodbye post he has had to bear someone still trying to tell him he's in the wrong.
Well he doesn't have to worry about it anymore.
Since mine was the only post before this that could possibly be construed as a "someone still telling him he's in the wrong." I'd like to make it clear I did nothing of the sort. Revis said he was leaving and that the reason for leaving was that he felt that every time he made a post "it only draws anger and criticism". My response was that if many people were angered by and critical of his posts then maybe he ought to consider that what he's posting is inappropriate in the first place. Since I assume he'd rather remain here and not continue to anger people and be criticized - this is not me telling Revis he's "in the wrong" it's not even me saying his posts are inappropriate - it's me offering a possible solution for him to consider to solve his dilemma. He could look at his posts that have drawn the most criticism and anger and see if they might have been inappropriate. Ultimately we each have to take responsibility for our own words and actions. If a person is continuously criticized then they can either think hard about what it is they're saying and doing, or they can withdraw from the people criticizing them. "Defender of the Sacred Cod" Capio pisces, ergo sum
Edited by - BConk on 11/15/2009 15:40:26
steve davis - Posted - 11/15/2009: 15:48:01
My own solution is to not care that much what people say.
Just like in my playing,I pay attention to what sounds good and
avoid what doesn't.
Voyageur - Posted - 11/15/2009: 15:50:09
quote:
Originally posted by chip arnold
...
The more secure a feller is in his experience of truth and understanding, the less he leans toward thinking himself superior as a bolster for his insecurities. And the less bothered he is when he senses himself to be the object of same.
...
Chip Arnold
True for us non-fellers as well!  I am quite sorry to see Revis is leaving. I disagreed with several of his posts, but he is a decent man who deserves respect. bosborne is correct in saying that our debates here will have little effect on changing anyone's mind about fundamental beliefs. I don't want to try to convince anyone here to accept the truth of evolutionary theory. I came here to make friends, not enemies, so what I wish I COULD convince people of is: to say evolution is true is NOT the same as proclaiming oneself an atheist. A little research on google will back me up, but I suppose it's much more satisfying to take sides and feel self-righteous. I think there is a much bigger truth far, far beyond all the little truths that our finite human minds can comprehend, and that it encompasses all of them, even contradictory ones. Fare you well, Revis. Mary "Do not pray for an easy life. Pray to be stronger. Do not pray for tasks equal to your powers. Pray for powers equal to your tasks." - Fr. Solanus Casey
BConk - Posted - 11/15/2009: 16:09:48
quote:
Originally posted by Banjoitus
You have swerved into a basic myth and fact of the BHO. The myth is that no political or religious posts are allowed on the BHO. Not so, one can spout all day long about almost anything regarding their being an Atheist, but let someone counter with anything even vaguely religious and whoa mule!
Maybe I'm going to the wrong forums to see them but I really can't say that I can recall any posts in which people spouted all day long that they're atheists. If a person says "I'm an atheist" in my experience, it would be treated the same way as if they said "I'm a Catholic" and no moderator would intercede. Now if the post thread goes "I'm an atheist" and someone else chimes in "You ought to be a believer" then it would be the same as if someone said "I'm a Catholic" and someone else chimed in with "You ought to be a Lutheran" In both case the mods should close them down in short order because they were debating religion which is prohibited. Certainly when I was a moderator I would have. And if those people persisted I'd have locked them out. Now if you think there's a prejudice against religion and in favor of secular matters then can you explain why science threads are getting locked down while discussions of Bible studies flourish? "Defender of the Sacred Cod" Capio pisces, ergo sum
Banjoitus - Posted - 11/15/2009: 16:29:29
If you had sited all of my post instead of a portion thereof I think I made it clear what goes on here, and will stick by it.
The truth of the matter is, argument on this site will change little in the scheme of things. There are just enough members to find a differing viewpoint from, but not enough to make a serious difference in the matters of the wold. 40,000 members are plenty to argue with (though it's the same few, and always has been) but not enough to sway a world problem one way or the other. I never saw a post by Revis I would consider mean spirited. Perhaps I missed it. Time was when people respected age, now it's not that way. I have the good fortune to have business dealings with many Hispanics who still offer respect to those older than them. Many if not all of them refer to me as Mr. Clint. They call their own senors Don, as in Don Salvador. Too bad we can't take a clue from them. I'm not saying you can't disagree with someone because of their age, but I think you should average the factor in when replying.
Clint
jfrebel - Posted - 11/15/2009: 16:32:04
quote:
Originally posted by Richard Dress
Chip,
What you say is true: some people have arrived at their beliefs after long and serious thought. Most people have not done so; they have just been told by a preacher or a professor and that's what they go with. No big deal--that's just the way people are.
But some people who don't believe in a god seem to think that they are somehow intellectually superior; they look down on religion, when all they have to fall back on when pressed is as a stale intellectual position which is at the bottom just more religious dogma in a different form. But it is really no different than the revealed theology that they disparage.
This is a pernicious form of intellectual bullying that I find very offensive. Especially it disturbs me when you look at religious rprejudice as just a small part of a wider tendency in most non-technical disciplines to treat their dogmas in the same way: looking down their nose at all aspects of Western culture and basing their disdain on the same specious dogma purveyed by their professors who are equally steeped in dogma rather than reason and rigorous explorations of truth.
I'm an atheist. Trust me jerks exist on both sides of this fence. I've had Christians tell me I'm going to hell, tell me I'm immoral, accuse me of devil worship, etc. as for folks believing something without good reasons this can apply to just about anything. I don't plan to debate the validity of either side of this coin, I only wish to say that there's plenty of arrogant christian bullies too. at the end of the day though I prefer the old saying: can't we all just get along? that and live and let live.
Sheldon - Posted - 11/15/2009: 16:46:48
Ahhh, the banjo seems to bring out the best in people . . . . . And to think some folks object to the way "Deliverence" reflects on banjo pickers . . .
Sheldon
jbanjoist - Posted - 11/15/2009: 18:24:51
The man has made up his mind and said his goodbyes and ought to be left alone and doesn't need anyone telling him what he needs to do.
He deserves at least that and a lot more than that.
Bconk you did a great job at ID-ing yourself.
Whether you were telling him he was wrong or not I stand by my above statement.
Jbanjoist
I'm a NECHVILLIAN!
EDUMACATE YOSEF!
You don't know until you KNOW.
Post unto others as you would have them post unto you.
Edited by - jbanjoist on 11/15/2009 19:12:26
HarleyQ - Posted - 11/15/2009: 21:54:51
Revis,
I've enjoyed your post also and wish you would stick around.
God Bless you always!!
Hoyt
(KJV)
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