|
Please note this is an archived topic, so it is locked and unable to be replied to. You may, however, start a new topic and refer to this topic with a link.
OPSU61 - Posted - 11/07/2009: 18:36:45
I have been playin the banjo for about a year and can quite a few songs. But i need to break away from other artist and make my own stuff. I know on the guitar that there is a blues scale that helps u learn cuz thats how i did. Is there such a scale for the banjo.
If there is please give me a tab for it!!!!
Thankya Much
Alpha Omicron - Posted - 11/07/2009: 19:40:49
The instrument doesn't matter; a scale is a scale. Here it is in G:
Image taken from you-know-where.
gdoc - Posted - 11/07/2009: 23:54:56
I'd apperaciate it if you would expand just a little more, maby a couple riffs to go along. No great detailed lesson, but I would like to be able to play a little blues on the banjo, but it is so forgin (sp)? to me, I kind of understand it "when" I hear it, but hear it so little I can't apply it.
Kind of like Ragtime music,... I like it, I can play a couple tunes, but I can't improve it.
Yes, I need to listen to it more if I want to play blues, but I'm at this point only wanting something to relate to.. If I get more interested, maybe I'll go out of my way to listen more. Right now, it's kind of a side line I want to know a little about.
I'm good at playing something someone else wrote, but weak at doing an original. That is the big difference between me and the pros.... But that is also a talent some have and others don't. I don't, and I know it.
I'm a great jutebox. Not the artist.
Press b-5 and out comes Foggy Mt. Bkdn.
gdoc
minstrelmike - Posted - 11/08/2009: 07:23:13
There are two approaches to learning to use scales on a chorded instrument. One is to figure out the scales from regular theory, the other is to make up your own 'scales' based on the chords.
You can find scales tabbed out elsewhere if you wish. To avoid personal flames, let me say right now the 'best' approach is being able to do both.
Here is the 2nd approach.
Strum your way through a blues song. Don't fingerpick it; strum it.
Spike your 5th string to B (9th fret) or ignore it and strum a basic blues song in E. Here are the standard chords. If you don't know the words to any blues songs r can't hum one in your head before you start, then you've already taken one step too far or one step too early.
If you want to play blues, you need to know what blues sounds like. period, not what one special banjo version of a blues riff sounds like.
E / A / E / / E7
A / A7 / E / / E7
B B7 A A7 E / A7 B7
Now try it in E with basic chords [open G tuning]:
E: 2102 (hammer the 1 sometimes and you'll hear 'guitar')
E7 2132 or 2100
A: 2222 A7: 2225 or 5222 or 2022
B: 4444 B7 (same as the barre As or) 4201 or 1204
Just try it strumming (it's why I put it in E instead of G). Get a good rhythm going before you try picking it or it will sound like bluegrass rolls because that's how most fingers have been trained.
Here are some word you can use if you wish.
Biscuits Rise So Nice
Standard blues
I said Baby your biscuits rise so nice
Baby, baby baby your biscuits rise so nice
She said darlin' you can have some You don’t have to ask twice
I said baby your jelly tastes so fine
I said baby your jelly tastes so fine
She said I knew you’d grow to love it It's just a matter of time
Baby your sugars' spread so sweet
I said baby your sugars' spread so sweet
She said darling you look hungry Why don't you come here and eat
I said baby you know you keep your oven hot
I said baby you know you keep your little oven hot
She said honey you know I've got to I like to cook a lot
===================================
Once you've got a good bluesy rhythm going by strumming (just use the ring/little fingers and keep your picks on if possible), then try picking.
Which notes should you pick?
Any of them that you use in those chords.
1st string: 0 1 2 4
2nd: 0 2 (3)
3rd: 1 2 (4)
4th same as first.
Play around with it. Now play your blues song in G.
Here is how to find your scale or notes you want to mess with.
1. What chords are you adding besides the standard 1,4,5 chords?
along with G,C,D (which form the major scale if you plot the fretting)
you are adding a G7 and C7.
The extra notes that go with a G7 or C7 chords are the extra notes you add to your picking possibilities.
They come from the chords so no one needs to show you anything else on the neck.
2. Find as many different seventh chord shapes as possible (this leads to the theory of scales in a more useful way for banjoists I believe). There are 3 major chord shapes F-, D- and barre-shape, but there are 9 different ways to shape 7th chords. Find them over the next few months learning scale theory via chord construction, but in the meantime, start with the ones you already have.
=====================================
This is how chord progressions work: If there is an extra note used beyond the major scale (or the 1-4-5 chords), then you're now allowed to use it in the song.
That's the way to explore _any_ tune you can get the chords to.
I learned Puff the Magic Dragon and Time in a Bottle just from the chord progressions by focusing on the fact that only one string changed between every chord change so that must be the important note.
The reason I prefer this approach over the scale oriented one is because if I'm playing a song on piano, banjo, guitar, mandolin, ukulele or autoharp, I usually start from the chords and work from there to express the melody as well. (With single-note instruments such as flute or sax, I start from melody and build up to harmonies (somewhat like chords) to add interest to the song.
Mike Moxcey
http://moxcey.net/mike/minstrel/index.html
gdoc - Posted - 11/08/2009: 19:16:35
this is helping a lot. I got to thinking today while cooking dinner, and realized the only blues I have heard, a few exceptions of course, is on TV comercials. Mostly for Diabetes. BB King? Not sure. The fact is also, other than that name, I don't know another. Lack of listening. That I am going to change by going to youtube and listening to a few players.
Do I understand this correctly, that you can only play the notes in the blues scale, and no other notes.. like for bluegrass, it's basicily open to any note that you like the sound of. A few notes at first sounded awful to me, but as I listened more, I liked the way they fit.
And do I understand correctly that only two chords are used per verse?
When I played around with the scale, I found a couple "riffs" that sounded ok, but lack the feeling to expand at this point. I know listening will help. Any other tips?
gdoc
gdoc - Posted - 11/08/2009: 19:23:38
almost forgot,, the song for Frazer....
Also, is Foggy Mountain Special a blues song just done fast?
Or Farewell Blues? Just the name? Doesn't sound blusy to me.
Like I said, I need to listen more, and will.
gdoc
minstrelmike - Posted - 11/08/2009: 19:28:53
quote:
Originally posted by gdoc
...Do I understand this correctly, that you can only play the notes in the blues scale, and no other notes.
It's not limited to the extra note, it's in addition to them. The actual blues scale is a different scale from the major scale major : G A B C D E F# G blues : G A Bb C D E F G but in the middle of a song, you get to do all the notes G A Bb B C D E F F# G. But that will happen if you just pay attention to all the chords you use. Mike Moxcey http://moxcey.net/mike/minstrel/index.html
Ira Gitlin - Posted - 11/08/2009: 20:31:50
"Foggy Mountain Special" is indeed a basic 12-bar blues; so is "Shuckin' the Corn".
"Clinch Mountain Backstep" is based almost exclusively on the minor pentatonic scale (G-Bb-C-D-F), which is often used in blues.
Scruggsnut - Posted - 11/09/2009: 08:14:15
quote:
Do I understand this correctly, that you can only play the notes in the blues scale, and no other notes..
It's music, you can use any, and every note. There are no wrong notes, just tin ears. Now, where and how you use these notes, well, that's what differentiates the players from the musicians. One excercise I like to do, is see how long it takes me to play every note on every string from the nut to the 5th fret. You will be surprised how quickly you can get them all in, and, still sound musical. Using this excersise, greatly expands your improvisational skills, and, sorting out notes you don't want to play from notes you do, and, the speed with which you can pick up tunes you have never heard before. I can't over emphasise the importance of practicing "playing", rather than just practicing "playing tunes". BWA Penrose,Oakville,Ontario,C
Banjophobic - Posted - 11/09/2009: 09:39:44
Ive posted a few videos in the Lick Of The Week ("LOTW") series about blues/pent scales on banjo. Check them out and maybe they can be of help to you. Here's a link;serch for "blues' in the titles-
http://www.jsutergraphix.com/LOTW/
Edited by - Banjophobic on 11/09/2009 09:42:10
phwill - Posted - 11/09/2009: 10:25:59
My favorite blues tune on banjo is In the Pines, you can download tab and sounds for it. It's in waltz time (3:4) and really is a pretty standard blues progression. I've played blues guitar for years and was interested in blues for banjo too, which is what interested me in that song.
Paul
banjoak - Posted - 11/09/2009: 12:38:37
quote:
Originally posted by Scruggsnut
quote:
Do I understand this correctly, that you can only play the notes in the blues scale, and no other notes..
It's music, you can use any, and every note.
There are no wrong notes, just tin ears.
Now, where and how you use these notes, well, that's what differentiates the players from the musicians.
One excercise I like to do, is see how long it takes me to play every note on every string from the nut to the 5th fret. You will be surprised how quickly you can get them all in, and, still sound musical.
Using this excersise, greatly expands your improvisational skills, and, sorting out notes you don't want to play from notes you do, and, the speed with which you can pick up tunes you have never heard before.
I can't over emphasise the importance of practicing "playing", rather than just practicing "playing tunes".
BWA Penrose,Oakville,Ontario,C
I recall going to a blues jam 30 years ago, and lots of older blues players were there, and some of the college jazz students would sit in, with there ideas about blues scales, and it lacked something. The old guys would laugh, and said something to point of "the blues is a feeling, it's not found in any theoretical scales or written rhythm" and proceeded to play a tune that defied all theoretical definition of the blues, yet sounded incredibly bluesy. You can play plenty of notes not in "the scale" in most music, some you can make any note fit. But not just anywhere, it has to be in context. You can;t just come up with a rule about which chords you use to determine what notes you can or can't play. It's about context. Sometimes (especially in blues) a note is just to get you from point A to point B. In the example above, it is the context of making it feel like it's climbing up to the end note. The idea of blues scale is just a starting point, don't get too stuck on the "rules". I agree it's how you use the notes. Listen to if it sounds like the blues, not to if it conforms to a theory.
Alpha Omicron - Posted - 11/09/2009: 12:54:04
quote:
And do I understand correctly that only two chords are used per verse?
Usually it's three. The most common blues chord progressions use the I, IV, and V chords. (Sometimes the V7 instead of the V. Sometimes both. There are tonnes of possibilities.) edit: typo correction
Edited by - Alpha Omicron on 11/09/2009 12:54:38
Scruggsnut - Posted - 11/09/2009: 13:52:11
You can also play an entire song on one chord. There don't have to be a "set" number of chords, or, number of bars that each chord is held.
This applies to blues as well as other types of music.
BWA Penrose,Oakville,Ontario,C
gdoc - Posted - 11/09/2009: 18:29:46
A true wealth of information here, thanks
gdoc
|
|
|
|
Feeds
