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J-Walk - Posted - 10/30/2009: 17:04:57
I have an old banjo with a WL tone ring. Maybe it's just my playing style, but I've never really liked the sound of it. It's just too "raspy" sounding for my taste. I've tried all the usual remedies, including a skin head, a heavy bridge, and a wool sock under the dowel stick. Still, not a pleasing sound to my ear. So it hasn't gotten much playing time.
I thought of selling it, but it's kind of a special banjo. It's the one that was featured in Dwight Diller's movie, "The 5th String" . So I don't want to give it up. I just want to play it.
Today, on a whim, I put on a set of Nylgut strings. Whoah! What a transformation. It's like having a brand new banjo. It sounds great, and I'll be playing it a lot now.
Edited by - J-Walk on 10/30/2009 17:05:26
fretlessinfortwayne - Posted - 10/30/2009: 17:14:00
John, I intend to do the same also with a special banjo -- original Fairbanks Tubaphone pot and reproduction neck by Wyatt Fawley. Nice looking banjo but it has always been a bit too bright for me. About a month ago, I put Nylgut classic strings on a fretless Enoch Tradesman with good results. No loss in volume, but a warmer sound. I think I'll follow your lead and do the same with this Fairbanks Tubaphone. Thanks for the reminder.
Dean
"Each one's got to have his own style. It's all creamed potatoes, just fixed a little different." -- Benton Flippen
Bill Rogers - Posted - 10/30/2009: 17:18:35
Both the WL and the tubby were originally made to carry concert halls with gut strings--in the days before amplification, so it makes sense that those banjos would sound really good with Nylguts.
Bill
mojo_monk - Posted - 10/31/2009: 05:19:08
After spending a year with only a nylon strung gourd banjo, I was finding steel strings too stiff and they seemed, for lack of a better explanation, to hit back while playing them. Out of desperation (and curiosity) I recently strung my 12" Brooks spartan with nylgut "classics" (unwound 4th string) and am blown away at how great the banjo sounds now. I can really smack the heck outta them so there is no loss in volume that I can tell and what a completely different sound! I've had folks at the jams around here tell me "now that's what a banjo's spose to sound like." Nothing wrong with that says I!
Sean
http://www.dearoldillinois.com
Adventures in Haitian banjo building:
http://seanbarth79.webs.com
dbrooks - Posted - 10/31/2009: 07:58:20
These threads about Nylgut strings on banjos with Tub-a-phone and Whyte Laydie tone rings intrigue me. For several years a played 19C Bay State banjos with Nylgut strings with the contra dance band and really had to play hard to be heard. I bought a Reiter Regent A-scale mostly to address that problem. The Reiter has had Nylgut strings in the past, according to previous owners, but I have been reluctant to try them because I worried about lost volume and punch. I even use a Fred Kelly Freedom pick with the dance band to get volume.
I love playing my older banjos with Nylguts. Maybe I will give them a try on the Reiter at some point. So far, I've been reluctant to move away from a setup that is working for me. Keep these posts coming.
By the way, last week our fiddler complained about not having enough banjo in the monitor to accompany him. I love this guy!
David
deuceswilde - Posted - 10/31/2009: 10:00:32
The key to volume is not using any modern bridges.
Thin pine or cedar and two feet.
Maple was the choice of Stewart, but keep in mind banjos at that time used 1/2" bridges, which weigh less. The three footed ebony topped massive bridges used today kill nylon's tone. They were designed to withstand iron strings.
A thin tight head will also increase volume and carrying power. I like the thin processed calf from banjoseen.
-Joel Hooks
Success always comes to those who have the money to buy it.
-The Adventures of a Banjo Player, 1884 p.26
Paul Roberts - Posted - 10/31/2009: 12:57:57
For me the question of what kind of strings to use has to do with the nature of the acoustics, in a particular situation. If I'm at home, fooling around or recording, I tend to go for a mellow sound. If I'm out in the world - especially if there's no PA - my old tubaphone with metal strings gets pressed into service. If I need to crank up to full horsepower, nylon strings don't cut through as powerfully as metal.
The big variable is how things sound in a particular situation; there's no one-size-fits-all. I sometimes yearn for a big old bluegrass-thing with a resonator in some situations, even though I'm playing clawhammer. Ever try to back up a group of noisy cloggers? In that situation the most important thing is to be heard, which means an abundance of power.
At home or recording it's an entirely different story. In that case I'm putting the sound under a microscope and trying to maximize the most desirable tone and setup. Different situations call for different setups.
Cheerio, PauL
http://www.banjocrazy.com/ PauL is a Gold Tone Banjo Dealer
http://www.youtube.com/user/strumstering PauL's YouTube Channel
banjered - Posted - 10/31/2009: 15:39:21
I like nylgut strings over nylon. To me, the sound is fuller, rounder mellower, just better. Nylons can have a harsher, clacking component to their sound but this can be modified considerably depending on how the strings are struck, fingernail angle etc. And what Joel said above. TC
Bisbonian - Posted - 10/31/2009: 16:16:21
John, I'm glad the Nylguts did it for you. That's a nice banjo, and I'm glad it's getting more play.
I have Nylguts on my S.S.Stewart, and just about everything else. Love em. I should probably make a better bridge for the Stewart, though; it's got an ebony top to it, and three feet.
"When Banjos are Outlawed, only Outlaws will have Banjos."
unclekurty - Posted - 10/31/2009: 18:28:34
John try Savarez High Tension Yellow Card strings. I've used nylgut and these on various banjos and I prefer by far the Savarez's. I like the nylgut on my banjo uke though.
.
deuceswilde - Posted - 10/31/2009: 18:48:48
quote:
Originally posted by unclekurty
John try Savarez High Tension Yellow Card strings. I've used nylgut and these on various banjos and I prefer by far the Savarez's. I like the nylgut on my banjo uke though.
.
I am curious because this suggestion comes up just about anytime nylon strings are discussed. Is this an attempt to get the sound of nylon while maintaining the ridiculous tension of wire? -Joel Hooks Success always comes to those who have the money to buy it. -The Adventures of a Banjo Player, 1884 p.26
Sultans of Claw - Posted - 10/31/2009: 20:17:37
I do like the dry, crisp rasp of Nylguts and even the way they feel under my fingers, but I also like the bite, bark and twang of steel strings . . . . decisions, decisions . . . . . 
Lee Callicutt
rinemb - Posted - 11/01/2009: 05:21:22
quote:
The key to volume is not using any modern bridges.
Thin pine or cedar and two feet
Joel, I believe you are right, there. I rarely fool around with bridges, but recently I decided to raise the very low action on my old skinhead Stewart-strung with nylguts. The only were tall bridges I had were modern design 3-footed thicker ones. They killed the tone and volume. Gotta order me some older types. Brad You may be man enough to take my woman, but you'll never get my banjo. May not the incidence of success, nor the pretense of retirement- Lessen the want of enlightenment.
unclekurty - Posted - 11/01/2009: 09:54:47
For me the nylguts just don't have enough tension. I like the feel of the Savarez's better and I get more volume from them. I think they feel more like gut too. And you don't need to deal with the stretching of the new nylguts. I do think the nylgut sounds more like real gut which I use on one banjo. I prefer the nylgut on my banjo uke because of the floppiness. I use a .38mm pick and get a good sound strumming.
Joel have you tried the Savarez yellow cards? You might like them.
deuceswilde - Posted - 11/01/2009: 14:10:06
Nope.
I have tried normal tension guitar strings on my early banjo. I did not care for them. They were in "Briggs' tuning."
I like the texture of the nylguts, kind of scratchy like rectified. I played Chris Sands strings on Clarke Buehling's Electric and they were O.K..
-Joel Hooks
Success always comes to those who have the money to buy it.
-The Adventures of a Banjo Player, 1884 p.26
CW Spook - Posted - 11/01/2009: 19:15:50
I do like the feel and sound of Nylguts; so much so that I have them on 2 of my 3 'modern' banjos (real gut on the minstrel tackhead). The only reason they're not on the other one is that I've been too lazy to change them on the one banjo that doesn't get played as much.
Rick
"The King has note of all that they intend, by interception which they dream not of. "
Henry V, Act ll, Scene 2.
dculgan - Posted - 11/02/2009: 04:58:27
I haven't tried nylguts yet but I last year I got my Vega Little Wonder (w/ homemade 5 string neck - pic on homepage) out of the case and made some changes. I had played this banjo in a dance band for years and the first five frets and the ebony between were pretty worn out. Bad enough that with the steel strings that were on there the intonation was suffering and there was a lot of buzzing. I had a set of heavy Chris Sands nylon stings around that I had taken off another banjo. I put these on the Little Wonder and found that the increase in string diameter helped a lot with the worn frets and it now played true. The sound is great too, and I've been playing this one a lot. I think these thicker, non-metallic strings, can make up for some wear issues. I still like the sound of steel strings but with my heavy hand I'm afraid I've worn out a couple of banjo necks and without a lot of repair these banjos are going to be strung with gut or nylon.
banjered - Posted - 11/02/2009: 08:38:40
The Saverez yellow card are thicker and have a bit of matte to their feel. It is no wonder that they feel like steel strings because they are thicker than Nylgut Minstrel strings which are supposed to be lowered 3-5 steps, basically lowering the key of "G" down to "E" or "D." Has anyone tried tuning Nylgut Minstrels up to "G"? Did you and the strings survive? In thousandths of an inch from 1-5 Nylgut Minstrels run .027, .032, .039, .028, and .027 while Saverez run .029, .033, .041, .030, .029. I used Saverez once a long time ago and liked them. I would prefer them second to Nylgut and before regular nylon strings. Haven't tried the Sands yet. I made a chart with all the major brands and their thickness - Bella, Sands, Aquilla, D'Darrio, Saverez and ye old fishing strings. I currently have Bella and fishing strings on a Saga 10P pony banjo cranked up from "C" where it is supposed to be to one note higher to "D" (dADF#A) for singing and hopefully eventually a fiddler to back my singing. R&D in progress! TC
maxmax - Posted - 11/03/2009: 08:10:57
Have you guys had problems tuning the fifth string up to A, with the Savarez High Tension Yellow Cards?
Thanks in advance,
Max
raybob - Posted - 11/03/2009: 09:00:35
I'm thinking of turning an old banjo with an A scale sized neck into a partial fretless. Does anybody know what sizes of Savarez yellow cards would allow me to tune them to A and D without a capo so I can play fiddle tunes with my wife and others ? I've had a low-tuned banjo before and it's fine, it's also difficult to play with others in the commonly used keys. Thanks.
Ray
"We learn from history that we do not learn from history." --G. Santayana
unclekurty - Posted - 11/03/2009: 12:52:55
I've broke my fifth tuning back and forth from G to A. I haven't had a problem leaving it at A. Like nylguts these strings last a long time. The Savarez Yellow Cards just come in the size Tom mentioned.
raybob - Posted - 11/03/2009: 13:21:46
Thanks Kurt, guess I'll have to look around then.
Ray
"We learn from history that we do not learn from history." --G. Santayana
banjered - Posted - 11/03/2009: 14:02:45
Uncle says, "I've broke my fifth tuning back and forth from G to A."
If there is the slightest burr, or, if the slot is too narrow, it will eat up your string MUCH sooner than otherwise. Try a little steel wool for small burrs. TC
unclekurty - Posted - 11/03/2009: 18:18:31
Ray I didn't mean to discourage you. I just don't bounce around as much with the 5th string with nylon as I do with steel.
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